Ranger Fan Central Graffiti Wall
Welcome New York Rangers fans and thank you for visiting our pages.We would love it if you would
some nice graffiti.
some nice graffiti.
Wednesday, March 10, 2010 at 11:03:12
Rhet0ric: I wouldnt miss him if he was traded, but Sather shouldnt just send him for a late pick or future considerations. He is worth more than that, he will still develope, and will be a decent D man. If the Rangers only needed him for the 3rd pair he would be great to have...but they are wanting him to be a top 2 guy, and thats above his head IMHO.
Wildcard
RF4L... DRURY needs to go... I don't care if we have to force him into accepting a trade or if we buy him out... the whole attitude of this team needs to change and getting rid of him and REDDEN is a good start... WILD... In regard to GIRARDI, I was making a joke... but it all seriousness, he was bad last year and worse this year... he looks like he's completely lost his game at times this year... he gotten a pass from the fans for the most part because he plays on a team with the R&R boys... I will not miss him if he's traded...
Rhet0ric
I was wondering if anyone else noticed the last couple of games, that when Prust was on teh ice, the puck seemed to stay in the offensive zone for longer stretches. For a 4th line type, he seems o know the game well. He puts the puck in teh right places, he seems to get back defensivly at the right time, sometimes cutting off a clearing attempt. maybe its been pure luck, but he seems like he is, how do you say it, "better than his skills alow"? I mean, if he had more natural skill, it seems he would be smart enough to be a really good player. Again it could be luck, but it just looks like Boyle is better with him than not. Also with the 4th line, I think Shelly already has more shots on net than Brash did, and he has a nice hard wrist shot as well...wouldnt shock me if he scored, unlike Brash who if he had scored I would have fallen out of my chair.
Wildcard
Vic - yea, what stevielegs said!!! lol
Greschner4
Vic stop with the logic and financial sense ;-)....you're are talking about dopey jiimmyboy and genius , they know better.
stevielegs
GRESH: Wouldn't it be better to manage the organization so that it spent less money, got more out of each dollar spent and put themselves in a long term position to host 6 to 12 playoff games just about every year?
Vic
I ahve said all season, I expect the Rangers to finish 9th, 10th, or 11th. And it looks like that is what will happen. I also said, IF the Ragners didnt have alot of injuries (and that happened) and if another team they were fighting for a spot with had alot of injuries, or injuies at teh wrong time for them, than the Rangers amy make the playoffs. Now the injury thing the Rangers have been lucky with, hasnt helped much if at all, but they have been lucky. The team they are fighting with, or one of them, Boston, just had one of those injuries that may cost them a game or two with Savard down. So the Rangers MIGHT slip into the #8 spot, but I still expect them to miss by a few points, maybe only 1 or 2, and be in 9th or 10th.
Wildcard
RF4L - I personally think that Avery has good hockey skills. The thing about Avery to me is that he is effective most in a short series where the opposing team has to deal with his antics whereas during a long 82 game season, they can just ignore his ass if they want.
Greschner4
Ooops, meant to add that I do get why many on here like Avery - he's one of the few players on this boring club who can actually instill some excitement in a Ranger game. The face of this club on way too many nights mirrors the captain's IMO - expressionless, emotionless, passionless. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
RF4L
There's a reason why Avery isn't doing that much - he's simply not a good hockey player. At times he has the ability to distract the opposition to the point where they are ineffective, but expecting him to make a difference on the ice with his hockey skills is asking too much, IMO. He's a 3rd liner, of which the Rangers are overstocked. He's pushing 30 and has never scored more than 15 goals in a season for crying out loud.
RF4L
Vic - to answer your question, yes those 2 playoff games are worth it for Jimmy Boy cause it complies with Dolans mandate of keeping the Garden lights on so that they can sell those $10 beers.
Greschner4
"... "Man in front of the net for tip-ins, getting a fourth man involved in the offensive zone cycle," Tortorella said. "I'm showing a tape of what happens when we shoot the puck at the net as opposed to wide and it's a breakout for the other team. "I can't teach them the skill and creativity. We have to try to manufacture some ugly goals. . . . We are 2-3 in shootouts and 1-6 in overtime, and those are points that come back and bite you." Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/rangers/torts_leans_on_gaborik_line_8NwHVwnlZuQI8I5sQlI7NO#ixzz0hm1erP8m ..............hope he serves popcorn with his video.........maybe a nice foot message & a cold mug of beer. Then a limo ride home. How about a group bonding session at the botanical gardens? He can plant tulips ( two lips) like he does on sather's ass .
stevielegs
ilya Dolan & Sather don't want to rebuild, nor does Tortorella. And I'm not interested in it either. They been playing the half rebuild, and half genius sign and drive. Another gm & coach would get to the goal, not these 2 ego blamers. ....The NHL will warn both teams before the cryer game, and neutering and playoff agenda will take over. If buttman got to pick the NYR owner or got along with this one, things would be different.
stevielegs
if anyone wants to experience the nostalgic sounds of Chicago stadium download Al Melgard on the Chicago stadium organ from iTunes when I listened to it I flashed back to some great ranger games at the old Chicago stadium . Bobby hull scoring his 51st goal breaking the previous record of 50, and my favorite moment a 2-1 overtime win in the 1972 playoffs when stemkowski fired the puck passed a screened Toni Esposito , with glen sather leaping 2 feet off the ice to set the screen in front . The rangers were badly outshot and outplayed but tied it with 40 seconds left on a brad park goal from his knees just outside the crease and won it early in the extra session when stemkowski and sather broke in 2 on 1 with sather setting the screen Bill Wertz , who rivals James dolan for stupidity and greed was the man resposible for not only tearing down one of great buildings in the NHL but in tearing down the hawks franchise from where it had been in the mid to late 60's when Bobby hull and the blackhawks were the hot item in Chicago and basketball was an afterthought . Although I've always been foremost a ranger fan, the aesthetics of the Chicago stadium, the crest and uniform , and the type of team the blackhawks were when I first began to follow the sport in the 63-64 season left an impression on me, and it's nice to see hockey return to prominance in Chicago, albeit at united center The organ still survives in las Vegas at the David maloof residence
docjay
Steve,Chin.2004 deadline was a fluke Slats never had any intentions to rebuild if it wasn't for upcoming lockout Leetch and Kovie remain Rangers .Some ppl were fooled by 04 believed that it can happen again.Part of me wants rebuild another doesn't , to rebuild for 4 or 5 years its misery being humiliated from game to game and nothig positive even with young players and garden fans witl turn on them by booing them of the ice and somekinde of chants,My problem with Torts is that HE"S NOT A TEACHER like Renney was ,Torts loses his temper and banish kids, Renney was a teacher he could explain them what they do right and wrong .
ilya
The only thing I really want to see the rest of this year is CARCILLO's head on a platter.
chinstrap
there is no reason for NYR fans to hope to make the playoffs this season, regardless of the experience for the rookies. Nor should they tank on purpose. This team is not progressing, they just keep changing the roster like rearranging the chairs on the Titanic. The gm & the coach are lost. They would have a hard time winning the Cup with an All Star team. Those two are made for each other as they shoot themselves in the foot.
stevielegs
EVETS: Exactly. If you don't have any chance then it is criminal stupidity to not take steps to put yourself in a better position in the future. Instead, the Rangers do the opposite. They pass on the chance to make the team better in the future to make a misguided run at mediocrity. They never build toward a goal. They should be planning to build a team that has a legitimate shot at a Cup in 5 years. All moves should be made with that goal in mind. Instead, they make moves that make absolutely no sense and destroy any chance of building a winner. Hey JIMMY BOY.....are those 2 home playoff games really worth it?
Vic
CHIN: I'm with you on Jokinen. Maybe it's fair to cut him some slack, since he's just come aboard, but it sure looks like he's just going through the motions. From what I've seen, I wouldn't tender him an offer, but I'm sure Genius will try to keep him, if only to save face.
Topshelf
CHIN: You should have just left it at "but we arent going to the playoffs".
Vic
I just have to question the merit in this team making the playoffs. Does anyone here think that if they sneak into the sixth or seventh spot that they could upset one of the Devils, Penguins, or Capitals?? The only thing making the playoffs does for this team is the following: it worsens our draft position, allows Dolan to raise ticket prices again next year, and gives us fans the ability to watch our team be systematically dismantled by one of the three aforementioned teams. At least if we miss the playoffs, we have the possibility of procuring a top ten pick. Ugh... torture.
evets1980
While nice on paper, the DUBI-DRURY-CALLY line was awful after being put together last night. I can't believe its taken TORTS this long to realize that DRURY and CALLY are both much better off with some semblance of a playmaker on their line. Hell, I'd put the CHRISTENSEN-PROSPAL-CALLY line back together. They were getting offense and we were scoring. GABBY can play with anyone--put him back with DUBI and whoever. I dont like JOKINEN'S effort a lot of the time, but we arent going to the playoffs unless he's producing.
chinstrap
Cooke/Savard - well...FIRST...a ref ALWAYS has discretion, which is why I can't understand how some of these brutal hits aren't whistled. We've talked about this before when it was Richards/Booth, and I STILL don't think that hit was clean by any stretch of the imagination...at the BARE MINIMUM, there was a deliberate attempt to injure. Yet no call? No suspension? No nothing? AND YOU WONDER WHY IT KEEPS HAPPENING?!?! Still, a stupid fucktard ref can call a hooking or tripping or whatever penalty when there's virtually no contact? HELLO McFLY!!! Anyone home?!? I'm sorry, but players don't police the ice. THE REFS DO. That's their job. I refuse to believe anyone could watch those hits, run through the rule book and STILL not come up with a reason to nail Richards/Cooke with a penalty...NEXT...The LEAGUE needs to take a proactive stance...I fully endorse the idea that a dangerous AND deliberate hit like these...ones where there was little question about the intent of the hitter...should be handled with automatic and indefinite suspensions. Again, the key here is INTENT...Suspend the guy until the player he hit returns to play. If that doesn't happen, then consider it a full-season suspension. I've played hockey for more than two decades and at some pretty intense levels. Certainly, the intensity runs high and players do some stupid things. But personally, I've always known where to draw the line, and taking someone's head off like that not only crosses the line, but blasts through with the force of a nuclear explosion. It's uncalled for, and Cooke should be out of uniform until Savard can return. PERIOD. You don't need a new goddamn penalty to do that either.
tdchi
TDCHI - and what you (and Gross) say about Torts indeed points out his coaching inadequacies but, to me, also points out bad this team is when even such players like that continually screw up..Waht an inferior team we have (both physically and mentally)..
Hospo
Gee, the surprises of the Wall......Me and Tdchi disagreeing...GaryRanger wanting more fighting and Desi and myrtle posting within a half hour of each other...!
Hospo
TDCHII _ to me, Backstrom is as good as it gets in the NHL...You don't even consider the 4 picks, not when you have the chance to play with OV, Semin, and Green and still have a good farm system..maybe other diffeent circumstances...If I'm WASH, I go for it for the next 5 years...supporting basically the top star sytem in the game with a team concept of shrewd pickups of lunch pail and greitty vet players and prospects from their regualr draft....But, as you and I have mentioned at one time or another, a key could be the goalie..Will they be another FlyerS?
Hospo
Hey Myrtle I told not to say anything, if my wife goes on this site I will kill you the same way Shelly will knockout Orr.
desi04
Hospo/E - The test balloon for a talented cap-heavy team is the Penguins. They secured one cup so far, and in my impression, aren't threatening for another. They have a threadbare farm system, that's going to be even more threadbare next season...Certainly, the Caps could sign Backstrom to big money...but you don't think they'd think twice about matching a big offer if there were FOUR top-picks involved? Again...ITS FOOD FOR THOUGHT, not speculation. Most likely, he gets signed to a multi-year as soon as the season's over.
tdchi
GaryRanger: So since I am on bitching about Avery today you want those agitators to police themselves? No disrespect, but this type of thinking has been just ridiculous to me for such a long time. I like a dust up and some emotion, but it is a sideshow. Players do not discipline themselves. Oh, if I grab and pummel Drury, I need to worry that Shelley is going to jump me? You can't believe that the instigator rule is preventing the players from keeping the game honest. It is a fantasy to think that they will. Avery would tee-off nightly on Broduer if there were not instigator rule and why not? So he gets pummeled by some behemoth. He doesn't care. He'll do it again, and again, and again. So what are you going to do to stop him? Nothing that can't be done already? slew foot? spear? board him? You want to bring back the 70's and the Flyers who routinely jumped every Ranger with skill during each stoppage of play? You really think that hockey players are afraid? When the fisticuffs don't work and believe me that putting the whoopin' on a player like Darcy Tucker is not going to make a damn bit of difference one bit. So now what? You spear him? Decapitate him? Make them not have tied down jerseys anymore? It would be just as PJ Stock said on CBC, (and I am paraphrasing) "with no instigator rule, I would have caused a riot on the ice." Players will not police themselves.
E
Torts on coaching: If at first you fail, fail and fail again. From Andrew Gross, who probably has the best Rangers blog these days: The top line of Vinny Prospal-Erik Christensen-Marian Gaborik, off the scoresheet in the two games since Gaborik’s return, will be given “another whack” at trying to create some scoring chances tomorrow but it doesn’t sound like coach John Tortorella will have much patience if the line isn’t producing...” And then if there wasn't a more damning piece of evidence about Torts' utter dearth of coaching ability, give this a read: First, Ryan Callahan, skating toward where Kaleta was coming out to the side of the net, did a skate by instead of taking him out. For whatever reason, Callahan peeled off to his left rather than take the body. Then, both defensemen, Girardi and Michael Del Zotto, follow the play behind the net. Finally, Chris Drury, skating in towards the prone Henrik Lundqvist and Kaleta trying to chip away, actually gets his stick caught under Lundqvist, creating two problems. One, it actually slightly knocked Lundqvist out of position and, two, it caused Drury to just drop his stick. So, to review, you have two defensemen behind the crease (Del Zotto seemed to make it back out to the far post), a forward peeling off to go back up ice and the player closest to the puck without his stick...”
tdchi
MF: I thought that Avery's cap number hits 4m next season. I thought I read that somewhere but if it isn't true, then it makes a more palatable argument for him staying.
E
Greschner4: First of all, I don't buy the whole Tortorella castrated Avery argument. Avery has yet to figure out his game post meltdown. Second, while the NHL refs clearly have a hard for him what does that say for his future here? And if Tortorella wants him to play castrated then why have him here? Sounds to me like you are making a compelling argument for punting Avery out at the soonest possible convenient moment.
E
Correction I disagree with drumming up additional penalties. I think they should eliminate the fighting instigator penalty and let the players police themselves. If that were to happen folks like Cooke would not pull this crap he if gets the crap beat out of him and not be allowed to hide behind the officials. If the officials just backed away and let him answer for his actions. After a few beat downs the Cooke’s of this world would not continue. It is one thing to get fined and another to sit out with a broken jaw and both eyes closed.
GaryRanger
I disagree with drumming up additional penalties. I think they should eliminate the fighting instigator penalty and let the players police themselves. If that were to happen folks like Cooke would not pull this crap he if gets the crap beat out of him and hide behind the officials. If the officials just backed away and let him answer for his actions. After a few beat downs the Cooke’s of this world would not continue. It is one thing to get fined and another to sit out with a broken jaw and both eyes closed.
GaryRanger
just a heads up guys, when Desi posts on the wall, be nice to him, he just lost a bundle at the track and if his wife finds out....lets put it this way, he will be the Avery in the Orr vs. Avery slugfest coming soon.....
myrtletrailers
I like the idea of the unnecesary roughness and would also make it reviewable so if a guy is laying on the ice in a pool of blood and no one saw anything they go to the booth and can get the guy tossed and 5 minute major. Each penalty is also then reviewed on a case by case basis but 2 get an automatic one game which gets exponentially worse with every infraction. It would get the headhunters like Cooke out of the game and make guys like Richards think twice about trying to rip someone's head off.
DanyloHalytskyj
I like this idea that was written by John Grigg at The Hockey News. Here's the link, like to see what you guys think...........http://www.thehockeynews.com/articles/32044-THNcom-Blog-Unnecessary-roughness-a-necessary-penalty.html
Greschner4
hospo - if you ask me, Cooke should get like 10-15 games but knowing the NHL they will give him 3-5.
Greschner4
Are you going to tell me that the NHL is not gonna suspend Cooke for what he did to Savard?...I sure as hell hope they haven't finished the review and decided nothing was warranted..
Hospo
E - to Avery's defense, he has been castrated by the NHL refs and by Tortorella.
Greschner4
TDCHI - Again, I think you are way overstimating the Caps potential problems..They will have no problem keeping Backstrom no matter what...They will be able to drop 4-6 of the players you mention (including FLeischman and Laic ifthey want) and not skip a beat...And yes, there is always a question about a goalie until he actually leads a team, but as far as young goalies go, the pair of Varlamov and Neuvirth is at the top of the list...And let's not forget that the CAPS BY FAR have the best team in the AHL with a few good prospects ready to play full time...And unlike the Rangers, they have a coach, a system and an organization that is completely coherent and headed in the right direction..I really envy them now and makes me sick to my stomach to realize what the angers have become
Hospo
E: thought Avery was $2mill salary & $1.9375 cap hit or vice versa, with Dallas picking up the balance....http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=NYR
mf
If Caps have cap issues (no pun intended), Backstrom would be almost as safe as Ovy/Green-Mcphee isn't Sather in that he (a)has a brain & (b)doesn't want to screw with his superstar in his prime by pairing him with a center he can't play with. I think Semin($5mm) would be gone long before a Backstrom-as he is Ovy-light. Sather isn't alone in bad signings however, as George did spend 5.5 mm on Nylander...
puckyou
TDCHI: We should have such problems like the Caps do. The price of success in the NHL is trying to hold together a supremely talented team. This team needs to shed salary in the worst way imaginable. One guy who I also think gets a free pass is Avery. He isn't worth the 4m that we now are on the hook for.
E
Rhet0ric : Giradi has been worse this year than last. He was solid last year for the most part, this year he has made alot of mistakes. Also, on Brash, the ONLY way I see him not with the Rangers is if a team needs to get above the cap minimum, than he woudl be perfect, wouldnt take up a roster space, but would take up cap space. I just dont know if any teams will be that low on the cap....so the chances are minute that it happens.
Wildcard
GRESH... alot of teams put guys in the minors in order to manipulate the cap... the truly bad part is that next year we still owe VOROS $900k and BRASHEAR $1.3 MIL... Brashear's full $1.4 Mil cap hit is on our cap next year no matter where he plays(unless he get's traded)... anyone want to bet he's with the team in camp?
Rhet0ric
Guys...just to reiterate...I REALLY doubt the Caps would let BACKSTROM go...and rest assured, the only way I could see something like that happen is if a team offers him something ridiculous...like a 10 years at $8 million per...or FOUR first-round picks...The Rangers, by their very cap nature, wouldn't be able to sign him to that contract...BUT...that would make it VERY difficult on the Caps to keep him in the fold. And if they were coming off a Stanley Cup win this year, they MIGHT just go for it...you get one cup out of the kid, then get four years of having two picks per; at least one of those picks probably being top-10ish...on the Caps' “cap” situation...it is indeed dire...and that's considering they do let go of Three-or-more, Morrison, Belanger, Corvo and all the other UFAs. Like I said, they have about $20 million to dish out, with 12 players under contract. The RFAs include Shoane Morrisonn and Jeff Schultz(both pretty big parts of their defense), Fleishmann, Fehr, Neuvirth, and Boyd Gordon...Not a big deal, right? At least not until you consider the fact that Laich and Semin are going to be UFAs at the end of 2011. And Varlamov hasn't shown yet that he's able to be an NHL starter...and that basically the team will need to jettison ALL its UFA players if Backstrom DOES command an $8 million per salary...Teams with these superstars are getting to the point where they're starting to feel the pinch of the cap. The choice soon will be to either fashion a balanced roster or keep one line of uber-stars, while stocking the rest of the team with rookies and AHLers...Again...this is FOOD FOR THOUGHT...not saying Backstrom is a Ranger or that it's even possible.
tdchi
RF4L... I completely agree with you... we may have 2/3rd's of a 1st line(at best) and two 3rd Lines sitting behind it... we don't have a legitimate 2nd Line... CALLY or DUBI are nice complimentary players, but neither of them can carry a line, even if they play together... WILD... we are not getting STASTNY for a guy we overvalue and a defenseman we consider a spare part... GRESH... We do have the cap room for Stastny, if we don't re-sign Jokinen, but we're never going to get him... TD... We would have to call a hit on the CAPS entire front office to pry BACKSTROM out of there... it's not happening... the only Centers we have a legit chance of landing is PLEKANEC as a UFA, trading for LECAVALIER, RICHARDS or PATRICK SHARP... I have no problem with VINNIE if we got rid of 1 or 2 of our bad contracts... Vinnie definitely needs a change of scenery... DALLAS was looking to save payroll by moving RICHARDS and at the time we were talking to them, we couldn't make a deal without sending back payroll... Now, by not re-signing OLLI would help clear out that room... CHICAGO is maxed out over the cap next year... and all reports indicate that they will be looking to move SHARP to help ease the cap burden (no one wants HOSSA)... Lecavalier or Richards would be a $7.8 Mil cap hit, while signing Plekanic and trading for Sharp would probably be a bit over $8 Mil... these are out best options at center... WILD... That must've been the longest pregnancy in history, because he played like crap last year too...
Rhet0ric
I didnt know Giradi and his wife were expecting. I have noticed, no matter who the palyer is, they play alot worse when the wife id pregnant. Usually right after the kid is born they play better. Watch any player with a pregnant wife, they are off their game...I noticed that with Staal down in Carolina, and maybe the same thing with Giradi. Drury improved some after his kid was born...I have seen it before that as well. I understand it, tehy are worred about more improtant things than hockey, and they should be. I know when my ex was pregnant, I was not as good at work, not nearly as productive for the months she was expecting.
Wildcard
Yeah congrats Dan, now instead of pounding your wife pound some dudes out of the crease or into the boards for once!
DanyloHalytskyj
There's a better chance the Rangers win the Stanley Cup than the Caps giving up Backstrom.
chinstrap
congrats to Dan Girardi & his wife for the birth of their son last nite.
Greschner4
TIK - true about THEODORE and another 4.5 mill..He defeintely is playing the best right now but for next year they will probablyy choose to go with youngsters Varlarmov and Neuvirth and be set for years to come no matter the outcome of this year
Hospo
Tik - you got the numbers correct. Theo is at 4.5 and is a UFA next year
Greschner4
I don't think the Caps are in too dire straits cap wise. I think they even lose Theodore next year, if they choose. He has to be around $4.5 million, not sure his cap hit exactly.
Tikkanen
TDCHI - I've watched Most of backstrom's games and he is already one of the best players in the League, even if he doesn't get the accoldaes..No way he goes anywhere..I really don't know how bad of a shape the Caps are ine...They will dump guys like Wlaker, Belanger, Morrison, etc..aftert the year...But you are right, A player like FLEISCHMAN may have to be let go...A decent player, but very streaky...DOn't think the Caps will lose much sleep about losing him, but he should be able to help another team at 2nd or 3rd line..
Hospo
TD, great person to target. I think he plays a good 2 way game and love him as a center. 100% right rather than resign OJ give the the money to backstrom. IF people say the money, well 5 mill for OJ and I believe the Rangers are 2.45 mill under the cap as constructed. I know Staal is going to cost more but there will be moves over the summer and I'm sure Marc will get his money. With Backstrom now you have 2 good lines going foward. Prospal?? - Backstrom and Gabby. Dubi- Anisemov/Drury - Cally. not bad
KIS
i just got this from the blog pages of SNY, this just illustrates how bad this organization is being run.....The NY Rangers have $3.625 million in salary for Donald Brashear, Patrick Rissmille, Steve Valiquette and P.A. Parenteau in Hartford......And its only half of what Wade Redden is making with the Rangers. What a sad state of affairs!!!!
Greschner4
count me down as one who has been priced out, who is just numb with the way this team is being run and who simply doesn't care anymore. I got better things to do with my free time like hanging wit my baby boy and quite frankly I don't miss paying for beer at $10. lol
Greschner4
tdchi/shonuff - the outcome of the rally just goes to show that the real fans of the NY Rangers have been priced out, don't care, are numb or all of the above......
Greschner4
Shonuff - count me as one who was surprised more than a handful of people showed up to the Anti-Sather rally. People protest things that actually impact their lives. Sather, while generally all Ranger fans agree, is one of, if not the most, lackluster GMs in franchise history, still hasn't performed bad enough to empty the Garden. I mean, I remember in the last days of Neil Smith, you could go to MSG after the puck dropped and usually get a pair of tickets for $30 bucks. Maybe I'm mistaking it on TV, but the building doesn't look that empty these days...The only way you'd really get fans out droves would be to double the ticket price or refuse to sell beer after the first or something equally disrupting...Personally(and the TANKERS will like this), I truly believe Sather will be gone along with TORTS if the Rangers don't make the playoffs. Sather came out of the lockout boasting a five-year plan...and to the outsider, it appears to have worked rather well. The Rangers steadily improved their farm system, have one of the top-ranked feeders in the NHL and made steady post-season improvements...that was until last season's meltdown against the Caps...and Sather's mindless retooling of the roster, most of which he had to abandon this winter anyway...Bottom line is when DOLAN is planning his summer vacation, he looks for that slush fund of one-and-done playoff revenues he's grown accustomed to getting every year. If and when he reaches into that jar and finds it empty --or perhaps filled with IOUs to Wade REDDEN and DRURY --he's going to start firing people. The first to go will be Torts...Then Sather...maybe(hopefully) both at the same time...On PLEKANEC, I wasn't saying he's the ideal pivot for the Rangers, rather someone who would probably come cheaper than JOKINEN and would be better fit as a pivot for GABORIK...I'm really more interested to see what happens with the RFA market this summer...seems to me, there's been a slowly eroding 'gentleman's code' among GMs,where they basically leave each others' young guys alone...There was the flap over PENNER a few years back...and there was Philly's attempt to sign KESLER; Vancouver targeted BACKES in 2008...and finally, KESSEL with Toronto...I personally think Burke didn't use an offer sheet as a courtesy to Chiarelli...SOOO...with all that said...There are some REAL nice names on the RFA list, and some that could be in play if things go sour...I've rambled about Kesler....but how about Washington's BACKSTROM? Talk about being in a cap conundrum...The Caps(no pun intended) are going into the summer with $35 million on the books and 12 players signed. No biggie, right? Well, you've got to figure Backstrom is going to want BIG money. Probably $7 million per. That leaves about $13 million to sign extensions to a team that includes FLEISCHMAN and a bunch of other RFAs that will probably command $2 million to $3 million per salaries...Now I don't suggest Backstrom will be allowed to walk necessarily...or at least one would reason that the Caps would give him just about anything he wanted...but there's a chance his signing will end up free up some other guys for the picking.
tdchi
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/hockey/blackhawks/2040676,chris-chelios-dui-charge-021010.article.............how did the genius pass on a missing piece to his hopeless puzzle? ..........the corporate culture has to change, or this will go on for a longer time. Step 1, don't make the playoffs.
stevielegs
Blueprints for top 2 lines on a futurcontendere : Cheap UFA/Kid (1m)-Plecanec(5,5-6)-(7)Gabby, LW (1-2,m player, kid or cheaper homegrown player or cheap UFA)- Center(Expensive star 8-10m)-right wing(3-4m player).
Ola
My thinking about Plec is that I think he could find a role on a good team somewhere down the road. Like, if we ever are going to become a contender we will need two lines that can score. I don't think Gabby is the type of player who can be a central part on a one line team if you get what I mean. Like you know, some guys will become extremely good if they are put in a really good environment. A player like Gabby can score 35 if he plays with trash, and maybe 45 if he plays with great linemates (+/- the usual amount, 5 maybe). Its not worth it to build a great line around him. So I think we will need 2 lines that can score. And that means that you maybe can afford 4 pricey players on those 2 lines. Like Gabby, another great player on a second line, then like two role guys. If Plec could be signed for a reasonable amount, he could be one of the later. 5.5-6 isn't a awful lot of money.
Ola
Not a knock on the Rally btw just thought alot more people would be there. Was kinda pathetic to see a guy chanting " Fire Sather", while wearing a Zherdev jersey.
shonuff
I think Dolan beat the passion out of every die-hard Ranger fan. That rally was a bust although a small few really tried. Cops kept everyone moving unless you wanted to stand in the maze. Didn't realize how small and doofy Larry Brooks is till someone said "Brooks" and I turned around and he was just standing there with his hands in his pockets.
shonuff
"BOSTON (AP)—Boston Bruins center Marc Savard has been diagnosed with a grade two concussion after being leveled by a blindside hit by Pittsburgh’s Matt Cooke(notes) in Sunday’s game." (Link - http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news?slug=ap-bruins-savardhurt&prov=ap&type=lgns)
Vic
New season similar results. Same chants. New president next year, new coach, more trades - same owner - same results.
norman
VIC - I agree with you on Plekanic and STEPAN..Kid has a ways to go and needs to prove himslef at a few more levels outside of WJC and College.---needs to show he isn't one of those many Hobey Baker winners and finalists that are washouts in the Pros..Let him take his time and see if he can make a 3rd or 4th liner first...If he's good, he'll rise to the top
Hospo
Vic - I think the doubts about STEPAN are few and far in between. I'm not penciling him into the top line pivot, but I'd be very surprised if he spends a full season in Hartford. If he's ready for the NHL, he'll be here next season. If he's not, he'll be back in college...but given how much his stock has risen this year, I'm of the belief he'll be here...on PLEKANEC...He's the only guy close to what the Rangers need on the UFA market. He's a decent center who can dish out the puck...My PERSONAL choice would be for them to put out a RFA offer to KESLER..The question is...how much would Kes be worth? Because the Canuks will almost certainly match $3.5 million per...But $5 million? Probably not...the really can't with the Sedin Sisters, Luongo and four defenders at $3.5 million per next season...although the Rangers aren't exactly a cap friendly team either....they could probably forward the money they're now paying JOKINEN to Kesler...He'd cost a 1st, 2nd and 3rd at $5 million.
tdchi
Bottom line is Sather's incompetence has painted the organization into a corner and that paint, unless something drastic occurs (ie the floor that's been painted gets ripped out), it's gonna be quite some time before that paint dries - IF it ever dries at all. How pathetic. SATHER SUCKS!
RF4L
td: IMO, Sather has been slow to address the top end skill gap on the forward lines for 3 reasons: 1) Those guys aren't exactly in abundance when it comes to availability 2) The Rangers are capped out and fit someone of that PROVEN ilk under their cap 3) The Rangers have no assets to offer up in a trade to address that, unless they are willing to create another equally big hole (ie trade the King to Philly for Jeff Carter and Van Reismdyk). In other words, I doubt Sather figures the answer is already in the system - if he is OMG! AA might one day be a good 2nd line center but he's a long way from that right now. Stepan has potential but the feeling is (from what I've read) he needs at least another year in college - he's hasn't exactly been tearing up the college leagues since the WJC. In addition, what that potential is remains to be seen - I think at best, he projects to be a good 2nd line center, but likely will need a few years before being an effective NHLer in that role.
RF4L
TD: STEPAN? PLEKANEC? First, lets see if STEPAN can make it at the AHL level before we pencil him onto an NHL roster. Second, PLEKANEC would do nothing but add to the glut of guys who ARE NOT #1 Centers. When I think of elite playmaking Centers it isn't that I don't think of his name as being at the top of the list......His name would never be associated with the list unless he was the guy who typed up the list. In other words.....he would be a great signing for SATHER and I'm sure he will offer a 10 year $120Mil contract to make sure that PLEKANEC doesn't get gobbled up by another GM.....
Vic
I wouldn't mind Plecanek/Brad Richards for less then 6m per on a long term deal. But I don't know, those two could go for a lot more then that. I wouldn't mind Mike Comrie on a 1 year deal.
Ola
Having seen several Ranger Caps match ups in DC one thing comes through over and over and over and over.....Caps have a great , smart, fan friendly owner ...and the fans and players know it and everything feels real good there. MSG is the greatest venue in the world....but right now....DC is THE place to see hockey. PS- sather sux, Dolan is a moron.
icebergslim
no playoffs = ruthless dolan.......it's better than 1 and done.......
stevielegs
Dolan is ruthless. Unless fans stop going to the games he could give a shite about some rally. This is a guy who regularly pulls channels off his cable system when they don't play by his rules. The only hope for change is an uprising by Cablevision shareholders if the stock plummets. Those are the only people he answers to. The rest of you can go to hell.
Zebop
http://www.nypost.com./p/sports/rangers/sather_rattling_OICSp8RS7gOFwBTYr61InN.....about the rally! Wonder if brooks was there cheering as well....
NV94
NV I couldn't make it, had to work. I haven't heard. But unless fans don't show, the NYR song will remain the same.
stevielegs
wild - Paul Stastny is signed til 2014 for 6.6 million. Would never fit under the cap but I like the idea. The main problem remains though, Glen Sather is in charge and it would make too much sense to go after a player like that even if he could fit him in under the cap. So it would never happen.
Greschner4
http://rangers.lohudblogs.com/ ... Carp, as usual, succinctly sums up the f-ups on the two Buff goals last night. He's watching what we're watching, we notice it, he noticed it ... I assume Tortorella will. And then, of course, we'll see the same mistakes again. A treadmill to nowhere! ... Hank must be crying himself to sleep, doing all he can to prop up this team. Imagine the record if the Rangers had a mediocre goalie. We'd be in Oilers territory.
Zebop
I don't for a second think Sather wants the team to suck. He's just lousy at his job and has been lousy at his job for nearly 20 years. It's as simple as that. It's gotta worse lately, I think, because he's all too often an absentee GM. He avoids the press and the public because of the criticism he's faced since he made the organization the laughing stock of pro sports in the early 2000s. The owner, for whatever reason, is blind to this, which basically means the owner is equally incompetent.
RF4L
Gresch/Stevie - I don't know about tuning Torts out....Becasue basiclly after the the first 8 games, the Rangers have been one of the two worst teams in hiockey..which is basically reflective of their alent level and huge gaping holes......Evey now and then they throw in a few good games (with The King Center stage) but that's it....Sather and Torts have put together one crappy roster, and one that is physically at a disadvnatege against most teams....With garbage like Brashear, Kotalik and Higgins gone, the compete and fire level is a little better, but we still have problems there....it should have been blown up or mortgaged at the deadline, not this crapola..
Hospo
hey stevie, how was the rally??
NV94
stevie - i've had that feeling since dec. it just seems like this team has zoned Torts out and its by his doing. You can only yell and scream at your players for so long until they just decide to say "f" it, i'm not listening to you anymore.
Greschner4
stevielegs : I does seem at times that Sather WANTS the team to do poorly. Hey, do you think he brought that hatred of the Rangers style of spending with him and wanted to make them a laughing stock worse than before? Maybe he is being paid on the side by the small market teams? Thats would at least make sense!!!
Wildcard
I say this. GO after a guy like Stastny from the AVS. They are stacked at center. Give tehm Dubi and Sanguinetti or something, maybe a 2nd rounder as well. The AVS dont have alot of young D, but some, and they dont have alot of depth at wing....they have guys who are good on teh team now, but only a few outside of that, and not alot of size on wing...they have Stewart and Stoa who are/should be top 6 wings. But most of their youth is smallish. They may want Dubi. Its a long shot, but Dubi can be replaced, if he develpes more than it would suck, but he may have reached his potential, and Sanguinetti may never really make it with this team, there aer two players in the NHL now who are offensive, do the Rangers REALLY need Sanguinetti? It cant hurt to try, and if a guy like that could be put with Gabby it would be a good top line. han you draft another big wing in the draft this year and hope he devlopes nicely. I know its all in a fantasy world right now, but if Sather doesnt try to do something like that than he should be shot IMHO
Wildcard
HOSPO there has been zero logic in not having 7D, with the likes of Redden, Del Zotto & co. Carrying 2 -3 extra forwards that even when dressed get 4-6 minutes, is absurd. It's like Sather wants to break his coach's balls. He did it last year too. And Lundqvist can't be happy with the D in front of him. This is one bunch of aggravating SOBs. This is not a fun team nor organization. They seem to be full of bad feelings. ....by the way Prospal & Del are in Hazlet NJ tonight for free.
stevielegs
;-)
Greschner4
Hospo - Oh he's deserving of the title. "clueless" cause the game has passed him by and he hasn't realized it yet and "jackass" because of the contempt he has for the ny media who are only asking the questions that we the fans want answered but since he's the winningest american nhl head coach, how dare we ask those questions of him. Clueless Jackass
Greschner4
stevielegs: I really think that if the cap wasnt so screwed up due to bad caontracts, that torts would want a kid like Potter in the lineup more. But if they call him up to much they will end up over the cap for the year. Redden and or Drury need to go. I like Drury, but if he can be moved, than move him in the off season. Than Sather can sign or trade for a #1 center.
Wildcard
STEVIE - And why have we had only 6 defenseman (4-5 of which struggle mightily at times)? The ineptitude of Sather and Torts in putting this team together while maxing out the cap....So we are left with just shuffling an incomplete deck--everywhere..
Hospo
Gresch - Doin't you dare call Torts a "clueless jackass"! he has not earned that exalted title! not even close!!
Hospo
there is not enough accountability, leading to pure laziness. Constantly scratching basically the same guys, and only having 6 D tells you the real story. The rest is keenan-light. They don't deserve to make the playoffs.
stevielegs
Re moving Dubi into Christensen's position and/or swapping player X with Y and/or making line ABC become like ADC - other than Gaborik who's now playing hurt and almost as ineffective as his mates, that's like changing the deckchairs on the Titanic. I mean, what's the point? This team barely has the assets to make up a strong 2nd line, let alone a 1st line. When you're that void of top-end skill if you want to be competitive you have to commit to a system that's built on being defensively aware and work hard shift in/shift out, game in/game out. Under this team's leadership (ie the coach and the captain) the latter isn't happening with any consistency at all. It's maddening. And depressing. And frustrating. And a sympton of a poorly managed team. Sather is ultimately responsible. Until that incompetent nob I see zero reason for anything to change. Hell, if the Rangers bottom out and land one of the top 2 draft positions, he'll probably blow that, too!
RF4L
RF4L - I agree that Drury should be sent to the press box for a game or 2. In fact, when Gomez was traded this past offseason, i was hoping that Drury was gonna be dealt also. Since it was our esteemed captain along with Gomez who were the main cluprits who quit on Renney last year and put us in this situation with the clueless jackass (Torts) as head coach.
Greschner4
zebop - understood!!! Count me down as another person who is totally unimpressed with Mike Sullivan as assistant head coach. If he's supposed to be Torts X's and O's guy then why does this team get parted down the slot every single game. Why do we continue to see 2-3 players chase after the same man with the puck leaving Hank to fend for himself against point blank shots. I'm with you, where is the improvement?
Greschner4
Guys, the reason I mentioned the coach and tape-watching is he's always weasle-ing out of answering postgame questions with,"I gotta watch the tape first before I can say." Well, what the hell is he looking for? It boils down to one of three things in my eyes (more likely a combination): The Rangers aren't buying what he's selling (maybe); he's an overrated coach (possibly); the players, most anyway, are average at best, and you can't squeeze blood from a stone (well, yeah!). ... the assistant Sullivan hasn't impressed me either. Where's the improvement in some of these players?
Zebop
I think Anisimov will be better next year. He wasnt as good in his first AHL year, and took off teh second...Im really hope that the same thing happens in the NHL...and I think he has 2nd line ability, the only question is can he use that ability. SO HOPEFULY Anisimov will be the 2nd line center next year, and if Sather can get a 1st line center than the top two lines will be set IMHO. Christensen is good for teh 3rd line...he has that type of game, hard working, defensivly sound, some offense. And regardless of what some say, Boyle is fine for a 4th line center, what else do you want? He is on the PK, he drives to the net (more and more as the year goes along) and with better wings he shows more. I just dont think there are many better options for 4th line center in the system, or out on the market, and why over pay for a 4th line center.
Wildcard
TDCHI -Torts has his worts and perhaps we could see a little more consistency under another coach, but no coach could do much with this crappy roster....Take you words on Christenson....Every Center is in way over his head and substandard for where they play...Not much different for many of the wingers...And at least three of the defenders are routinley garbage in their own end..Stinksfroim top to bottom..
Hospo
Gresh - I was about to write the same thing! Zebop - The Rangers' startling inconsistency --games where they look like an offensive powerhouse followed by games where they look like they couldn't score on an AHL team --is emblematic of a coach who is more of a cheerleader than a play maker. The guy needs to stop 'letting guys play their game' and start looking at some of the things that we as fans notice. Again, I don't think this is a team to challenge for much of anything. But if there's one piece that clearly doesn't fit into the equation, it's TORTORELLA...This team would probably be in the POs with a coach like Renny...on CHRISTENSEN - he's a space filler. As decent as he's played, the guy simply lacks a top gear to get things done. He's got 15 points as the Rangers' top pivot on a line with GABORIK for heaven's sake! Personally, I still don't understand why DUBINSKY isn't centering that line...in fact, I've always wondered why they didn't try AVERY-Dubinsky-Gaborik for a change, and possibly move PROSPAL back to the center between Drury and Callahan...Ola - I have no problem letting JOKINEN go, but only if one of two things happens: STEPAN leaves U-Wisconsin and is ready to be a top-two center or ANISIMOV steps it up and is ready to take over...I have a feeling the only UFA center that would be worth it for the Rangers(PLEKANEC) will be signing a pretty serious deal after this season's numbers...And one of the main reasons I think Sather has been slow to bring in reinforcements at pivot are because he believes he's got the right mix in the system already.
tdchi
Puckyou _ I saw that...and it's pretty obvious that Del Zotto has been seeing that too the way he has been playing "defense" this year....Hell, I think it was he Pitt game where he made a good defensivel play late but then on the nex shift gets totally caught in the offensive zone....We could use and offesnive D-man with decent decent defensive play/instincts to show DZ the way..
Hospo
Anybody catch the Cap game Sat. night? On one play, a Cap player (forget who) was racing down the slot, and a Ranger player was literally one stride away, and the Ranger player gave up and watched him skate in for a scoring chance, uncontested. It was obvious if you saw it, he didn't even try.I'll give you a small hint who it was. His initials are WR, and he wears #6-as in 6 million a year.
puckyou
WILDCARD - AA/Chritiansen/Boytano is far from OK as a 2nd/3rd/4th line trio...and are pretty much substandard (in general, even if some games they p[lay OK) for those slots ...Not saying they don't try, but our depth at C is horrible...
Hospo
Zebop - nothing for nothing, but your asking for a man who acknowledges that he isn't an X's and O's type of guy to actually teach Callahan something. It just isn't gonna happen from the winningest american NHL head coach of all time. (I laugh so hard when i say that out loud, what a joke)
Greschner4
Wild, that's what I mean by Callahan assuming. If he had simply stopped instead of thinking the Rangers would regain control of the puck -- which he obviously did since he was heading the other way! -- Kaleta doesn't score. ... All I know is that I hope Tortorella notices the same things watching tape that amateurs at home do. Ya gotta wonder because the Rangers aren't improving. They're on a treadmill to nowhere with this current collection of players.
Zebop
I won't even comment on the fear of making body contact in the defensive zone, but is it asking too much for a Ranger defenseman to hit the net on a shot from the high slot (I've given up on point shots). The Rangers have the Sabres scrambling like a midget team, the puck comes to Redden in the high slot and he shoots it wide (which has happended multiple times this year). Good teams bury the shot or the rebound on such a play--the Rangers shoot wide. Over and Over.
VtRanger
wild: For sure I'm not absolving anyone on the ice with Drury of blame and I agree that Cally turned away, not to mention Daniella Girardi's great vantage point from behind the net. Drury, however, isn't scoring, is making $7,000,000 and is wearing the C - shame on him!
RF4L
Zebop : On the OT goal, Cally, it looked like, thought he was going to get the puck, he got his stick on it, but not hard enough, I tihnk he was turning to go up ice with it. It was a mental error IMHO, a bad one, but your correct, the Ragners dont have that JAM around the net. At least not all the time, you see it now and again, but not every shift. They NEED a D man who will do that every shift, once a player starts doing that, other players start doing that. Its just the way the team is built, and all it would take would be a couple guys doing it, and they will all pick it it, well at least most of them. But it starts behind the bench, and Torts for some reason is affraid of taking any penalties at all.
Wildcard
The OT goal was the epitome of the Rangers 09-10: a guy allowed to take multiple swipes at Lundqvist w/o any fear of being knocked down, crosschecked, slashed ... whatever. Drury did lose his stick somehow, but the replay clearly shows Callahan cruising by and never bothering to nail Kaleta. He assumed someone else would, I guess. And Buff''s first goal was the result of a horrible defensive play by Gilroy, who simply allowed the Buffalo player (Mair maybe) come right out of the corner without even laying a hand on him. Horrendous! And on Dubinsky, Carp pointed out in his blog (and Stevie mentioned here) how he peels off guys, like in the Wash. game. I've mentioned that more than once here: in my opinion, it's part of Dubinsky thinking he's a prancer now, he doesn't have to play the tough game, he can simply stickhandle around guys when he has the puck and brush by them when he doesn't. He thinks he's better than he is, I firmly believe that. Watch him next game, how often he can nail a guy (a la Callahan, who throws hard checks ... except against Kaleta!) and decides to let them off the hook. He's not a playmaker at all (he's a horrible passer), which means he needs to play the power game. But that's above him at this point, apparently. The only think I like about Dubinsky is his hatred for Crosby.
Zebop
RF4L: I dont think Drury was really the coause of that goal...come on now. There was plenty of blame to go araound. Yes he wasnt great on that play, but for the most part he in NOT the guy messing up around the Rangers net, so to press box him for one mistake is silly. There are MANY other palyers who need that long before Drury. Redden, Roszival are the two that come to mind the most. They make mistakes so often, that when they only make them on every other shift I find myself saying they had a good game!!
Wildcard
Hospo : Now dont get me wrong. I dont think he should be the top line center. But as of late he has played well there, and I was just making the point, that sometimes a player needs th right situation to be his best. I think Christensen would be good for the rangers 3rd line, he is defesivly resposable, and has some offensive ability. Keep him around since he wont cost much. And I think Anisimov could really be teh 2nd line center, he isnt to that level yet, but I think you put him on a line with good wings he will be OK. The main thing is of course the team needs a true Number 1 Center that can work with Gabby. Than the other centers will be OK, maybe not great, but good. I think Anisimov, Christensen, Boyle are a fine 2nd/3rd/4th line center group.
Wildcard
stevie: You're right and that peeling off mentality was epitimized on the Sabres' OT goal. Drury let the Buffalo player try a wrap-around, then actually bang away at the puck without even making even a mild attempt at initiating body contact. Worse, Drury lost his stick as he did what almost everyone on this club does - stare at the puck instead of the puck-carrier and STILL didn't bother to try to push the Sabre off the puck. The $7,000,000 man, who's on track for a resounding 15 goals, sure set a wonderful example on that play, didn't he? Torts should pressbox him for that pathetic display, but of course, won't. Save that for the Lisins and Voros of the roster!
RF4L
Jokinen IMHO definitely should NOT be resigned. He makes the team better, but that don't say much IMHO. Most of the time he is skating is no-mans-land. I rather have a center who might put up fewer pts, but is better at lifting the team. We have guys who can score, at least more then we are now. The problem is that we as a team can't stand up.
Ola
the NYR are playing girlie men hockey, and that's why the results are not good. Getting tough guys and not letting them intimidate is a waste. And few play the man, most play the puck or peel off. And the coach just rides the stars into the ground, then complains about them. I doubt he's liked or respected.
stevielegs
wild: Gotta say that when you start comparing your club to the Atlanta Thrashers in a positive way, you are sure grasping at straws. The Thrashers, despite until a few weeks ago having a player equal in skill to Gaborik, have made the POs once (ONCE!) in their franchise history. That's a pathetic record IMO and if that's what we as fans have to compare the Rangers too...well...pretty bad. And as impressive as Peverly's been for Atlanta, it's a stretch saying he's even a good 2nd line center. The Rangers lack of top end skill is pathetic. Take away the goalie and the Rangers would be challenging Edmonton for last overall, of that I've no doubt.
RF4L
Greetings - Was down in DC on Saturday and the family vacation was great - the Terra Cotta Warriors exhibit at the National Geographic Museum was pretty cool, nice weather too. The game was dismal. We are just not a good hockey team. We are not a bad hockey team, we just are a middle of the pack team that is generally not very interesting to watch. the Rangers fans that were up top in the building were much more entertaining then the product on the ice. All in all I thought Auld played well. Callahan, Anisimov and Dubi were the only Rangers forward that caught my eyes with any consistency. Rossival looked clumsy and most everyone else just blended into the background. Drury had no bearing on the game and Gabby is not right. Caps are legit, we should have traded them Hank just so we have someone to root for into June. Gotta say, I've been going down to DC since the new building opened and they put on a nice show down there. All of the years that Leonsis put up with loads of empty seats even when he was spending the money it is nice to see the fans responding and Washington becoming a hockey town. having an owner you don't despise must be nice. I'm a Mets and Rangers fan, it's been too long since I can say that.
jimsherma
Torts gets blinded by talent and thinks that having your 9 best guys on the ice for the entire game while the rest watch is a winning strategy. There is a reason that we were winning and scoring when Gabby was out. Because we rolled most of the guys and the top two lines were fresher to do more damage when they were on the ice and the bottom two lines were into the game as opposed to trying to do too much in one shift not knowing if you will see the ice again.
DanyloHalytskyj
I'm glad I was plastered for last night's game. It turned out to be the best part...The saddest thing about this weekend's games are that the Rangers, believe it or not, were not far off from wins in two of those games...I didn't watch Washington, so I could say there...I said it before and I'll say it again: As problematic as some people view this roster, a major contributing factor in the Rangers' piss-poor play is TORTORELLA. The guy obviously didn't learn much from his time in the Olympics...and I frankly think this team has tuned him out. His BS shouting act certainly doesn't motivate them...RF4L - I was mentioning this the other day: The Rangers seem to play like more of a team when GABORIK is not in the lineup. It's something I was noticing in pre-season(though I didn't know it then), and come to realize both times he's been out of the lineup. There appears to be a 'get the puck to Gaborik' push when he's in games. When he's not, they actually pass it around a bit more. Less of this BS with the homerun pass...You've got to think SOME of that is the coach's fault, since whenever he's OUT of the lineup, suddenly we start seeing offense from guys like Callahan and Dubinsky and Drury...Coach T did seemingly rely on three lines last night, which was a pleasant surprise. Now if he'd only do that regularly and remember that he's got a fourth line too...Shelley had five hits last night with less than 9 minutes of ice...tied for the team lead with Staal. Not much more to say about what little I can remember about the loss.
tdchi
WILDCARD - Please, let's not defend Christiansan as a top liner....Yes, he has shown some good things here and there and earned ice time on the team....but his production is still minimal and It's absurd that he is on a top line and shows how truly bad the Rangers are......And one thing abiout Peverly, at least last year he was about a PPG player for about 40 games (something Christiansen has neve come close to) and earning a chance at the top 2 lines this year..
Hospo
On Christensen, I think that Sather should get a real #1 center if at all possible. Dont resign Jokinen. If Sather keeps teh bulk of the roster I say the lines would be good if they were. Prospal/new#1/Gabby - Dubi/Chistinsen/Callahan - Drury/Anisimov/Avery - Byers/Boyle/Prust
Wildcard
Bob : Having a guy off of waivers as a #1 isnt something that just the Rangers have. ATL has that as well with Peverly (sp) He was picked up of waivers and is their top line guy. With a player like Gabby you shouldnt need a high skill guy, jsut a guy who is good enough to carry the puck and makes good passes. Christensen does that. He works hard, he is good in the D zone, he makes goos passes. How many times last night, and over the last few games has he set a guy up only to have that player miss the net, or have the shot blocked, or a good save made? I think you need to look at what a player is doing NOW, and for the Rangers, NOT how they got him or what he did before.
Wildcard
that link has the Rangers selecting Nino Niederreiter as the 7th overall pick..........Here is El Nino in the skills competition.....lol ............http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uv7PZ4ooyCc
TradeStar28
Anybody that expected more then 2 points in the three games against Pitt, Wash and Buff would be nuts..The Rangers did what they are capable of...Personally, I just find the Rangers hard to watch..whether they are scoring goals or not...just find them utterly boring...probably a combo of the style of play, the lack of jam and fire at timportant times, and what Sather has done to make this a mediocrity-seeking franchise (and often failing)
Hospo
What a mess. Should have sold at the deadline. As for Torts.....maybe the problem is that when Gaborik is healthy, he plays 2 lines once the game is half over. Maybe it is due to his schizoid line combos. I think it is due to lack of talent. We have a waiver wire guy as our #1 center. Poor Henrik.
Bob
Welp, didn't make it through 2 periods last night. I was dozing off so many times during the 2nd that I just decided to call it a night. I've reached the point where there is no hope for anything significant this year (actually I reached that conclusion before the season even started), and I don't see anything that would give me cause to have any hope that this team will be anything other then a mediocre collection of misfits for at least the next 3 to 5 years. Firing SATHER and TORTS doesn't even change that. Even if a new GM were to come in it would take at least that long to get out from under the horrible contracts that are weighing the team down and begin to rebuild. Even if they were to draft HALL this year it would take him at least 3 to 5 years before he was ready to carry a team the way CROSBY, AO, MALKIN, etc. can, and that supposes he becomes the type of player those other guys are. At least I still have the GIANTS. I also have the Texas Rangers, who I've been following the last few years. I stopped following baseball in the late 80's but I am regaining my love for the game. As for the NY Rangers, I think the only way things change is if those of you who buy tickets and go to the games just stop supporting this team financially. I don't see any hope that the Rangers will ever be a Cup Contender as long as the DOLANs own the team. If it isn't profitable for them then maybe they will sell. FIRE THE DOLANS! FIRE SATHER!
Vic
Its great to be a die hard sports fan. When you want to get your mind of something, you can always dive into the world of sports. A man needs a hobby. The problem is that I am a fan of the NYR. As soon as they suck me back in, they repel me back out and make me puke of disgust for how badly they are managed.
Ola
So what's with this team scoring a bunch of goals (13) in the 3 games that Gaborik missed, then scoring 1 in the 2 games he's played in? Is that a coincidence? Or do the players and the coach do things differently when Gabbie's in the lineup? IMO, whatever the reason (IF there's a reason at all), it's simply another indication of how screwed up this team is. It's getting to the point where I'm starting to take on the mindset that the sooner the season ends the better. It's both booooooooring and frustrating...
RF4L
mf- I think Steve Yzerman shoudk be candidate 1, 2 and 3 to replace Sather as a GM. First of all, he isn't Detroit bound. He recently said that he wants to manage his own team. Holland is the best in the game and easily have 15 years left in him. Does Yzerman want to wait untill he is almost 60 before he takes over a team? I don't think so. Second of all, he must know what it takes. There is so many false "truths" about what it takes in the NHL, about how you build a team. Sather is falling for them all, Detroit have always done it their own way. Yzerman would do the same in NY, no matter which way the wind blows. Like look at Sather for example. If we don't forecheck hard, and spend time chasing the puck all over the ice instead, what will Sather do? Yes, he will get harder working players. A coach who can make the players work harder. You can't forecheck, if you don't have the puck behind the net in the attacking zone. But Slats will never think that far.
Ola
chinstrap- Lol. Great quote. Just when they suck me back in, they always find a way to make me sick again. Can a Sather built Ranger team be described in a better way?
Ola
http://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-2010-1st-round-mock-draft/
mf
Just when they suck me back in...
chinstrap
For the goal Callahan...Dubi... Anisimov... Del Zotto .... all young Rangers ..the future isnt sooo bleak... regardless of this yrs 10th place finish
Jake0104
Glad he put Dubi back out there. Huge goal.
chinstrap
I like Anisimov and he'll be a good player, but I'm not sure why he's never the odd one out on the 2nd PP unit--its been Dubi or Christensen. And as I type that, the Sabres score. Thats all she wrote.
chinstrap
DANY--Great point, I've noticed that too.
chinstrap
Sure looks like the coach has them leashed and unmotivated with low morale. The NYR are LOST.
stevielegs
Renney,
HamiltonHellhound
Torts wants his guys to play with controlled emotion, but he looses it steady on the bench, I wish we could have the intensity of Torts, the smarts of Rneey combined in a coach, and of course, Sather FIRED
HamiltonHellhound
Not just Avery - anyone else notice how Prust was neutered after game 2 as a Ranger and probably told to fall in line into the not too aggressive category.
DanyloHalytskyj
I'm pretty sure the Rangers are feeding AVERY a steady diet of Prozac.
chinstrap
Matt Cooke is a gutless visor wearing punk
HamiltonHellhound
You know when playing a Ruff club you better keep your legs moving as his boys are always hustling, superstars on his team or not.
HamiltonHellhound
FIRE SATHER
stevielegs
carp .....I want you to watch the Belanger goal develop. Isolate on Dubinsky. The video starts after Dubinsky had a chance to smash No. 26 in red, and instead brushed him. Then watch how many poor plays Dubinsky makes, and how lazily he glides around. I am not blaming Dubinsky for the loss. But this play is so typical of the Rangers. You see one or two guys playing like this on a given shift all the time. And this is why they’re mediocre players, and why the Rangers are a below-average team having a below-average season."....http://video.nhl.com/videocenter/console?hlg=20092010,2,958
stevielegs
If Matt Cooke was a Ranger and not a Penguin he'd probably be on his 5th suspension this season by now.
DanyloHalytskyj
OLA.McEachern would be our top 6 forward the guy could hammer 25-30 goals in his prime , im hoping Dubi can develop into that type of a player at the moment with his skating ability .
ilya
Ola: a while ago you were calling for Yzerman. Do you see him as a coach or GM ? thanx
mf
Vic- I agree back! ;) Like, I wouldn't bet either way when it comes to Christensen holding up for a season. That remains to be seen. He could go either way I guess. He isn't a diamond in the rough, but there is plenty of guys out there who have had good careers without being "great" players. If Christensen gets experience at the highest level in the NHL, can improve some with time, and before know it he could become like a Shawn McEachern, Stephen Heinze or sometone like that -- type of scorer.
Ola
bazzer- Its google ads, they are "personal". Have you been surfing around Penguins sites lately? ;)
Ola
While listening to the game last night I heard Dave Maloney say the strangest thing.. He was talking about the old time mask that Auld had on ,much the same as Osgood's old helmet and cage mask ? Then I see the highlights this morning and Auld is wearing a regular style mask ? What's up with dave on this one ?
Newfie_Ranger
Why is there an ad for Penguin tickets on the wall.?
bazzer
Why is there an ad for Penguin tickets on the wall. Someone trying to piss us off?
bazzer
Anyone have any input on the DRAFT?? ...alot of sites have us taking Vladimir Tarasenko with our pick.... I like the kid a lot but I still like Kirill Kabanov even more... if not for wrist surgury, he could've been a Top 3 pick...
Rhet0ric
RF4L... I don't agree, but you could be right... but do we have the time to wait? Gabby and King are both 28... How many years do we wait while certain guys develop? I'm not saying we just trade him for the obligatory aging vet as we've done in the past... but if we have the chance to package Dubi to get a Nathan Horton, we would be crazy not to do it... Horton's scored 62 points twice already in his career, he could be the power forward we've long craved and he's only a year older than DUBI... IMO, this is the kind of deal we need to make to imrpove this team... STEVIE... We have to be careful, because there are guys out there that are actually worse than SATHER... Lightning GM Brian Lawton is another one I wouldn't touch with a 10 foot pole... Speaking of the BOLTS, their new owner is currently looking for a new CEO to run the Hockey day-to-day operations, we should start a Ranger FAN letter writing campaign for him to hire Sather... In reality though, it's more likely that SLATS renounces his GM duties and focuses solely on his President duties than it is that he gets fired by Dolan... GABBY... don't be shocked if he goes down with another injury while playing with a sore groin...
Rhet0ric
Vic dubi missed scoring and his man scored against him,and he takes a penalty late in the 3rd. He's still young with lots to learn.
stevielegs
STEVIE: Thanks for the correction. I thought Versus was owned by Cablevision. My bad...
Vic
As for the game last night.....AULD was good. CHRISTENSEN was good. DUBI's play in the offensive zone was exactly what I want from him. He was strong on the puck and very good around the net. He didn't try to do too much with the puck on the rush and instead dumped it in and fought for it down low. He didn't handle the puck well on that one 2-0 opportunity but in his defense you could see that the ice was crappy last night and the puck was bouncing around like crazy. DUBI's play in the defensive zone wasn't great last night and he got burned for a goal when he was late backchecking. Not too much else was positive IMHO and I thought that may have been GABBY's worst game of the season. OLA: As for CHRISTENSEN, I agree. He is a good depth player to have on a team. I don't know that he can ever play a full season as one of your top 6 forwards but he is a great C to have stashed on your roster in the event of injuries, etc. He steps up and plays well when you need him to. I didn't think the Caps played well at all last night and the Rangers never really had a chance to win that game. If those two teams played 10 times in a row I give the Rangers a chance to win 1 or 2 of those games tops. Unfortunately that is the disparity in these two teams and will be for at least the next few years.
Vic
Vic Comcast owns Versus
stevielegs
Hopefully the paying customers don't go tonight to toyotavision's game. Otherwise the product will not get recalled and fixed.Management is the main problem. Potter should be in and Redden out or used as a 7th.
stevielegs
mf: No surprise there. A lot of folks wanted to blame DirecTV for the Versus debacle but the real culprit is Cablevision and the Dolans (who own Versus). Cablevision seems to have these kind of disputes with everyone.
Vic
I wonder how much longer Torts will last after Gabby hurts his groin very seriously again.
DanyloHalytskyj
I like Christensen. He is more well rounded then most "AHL" fodder. He can really rip the puck, and have some offense overall in him. Wouldn't mind keeping him around.
Ola
Christensen was easily our most effective forward last night and he got rewarded with 18 seconds of power play time.
DanyloHalytskyj
Why cant the Dolans play hardball with the GM of the Rangers like this ?????? No ABC for Cablevision customers By TIM PERONE, ED ROBINSON and TAYLOR K. VECSEY AP Last Updated: 9:29 AM, March 7, 2010 Posted: 4:02 AM, March 7, 2010 Comments: 15 | More Print ABC ya later! The alphabet network yanked its signal from Cablevision early this morning after the two companies remained deadlocked in a nasty dispute over fees. More than 3 million subscribers in the tri-state area may miss tonight's Oscars broadcast -- one of the year's most-watched programs. "Cablevision has betrayed you again," read a message that scrolled across the screen two minutes before midnight, as the hit show "Lost" was being broadcast. "First you lost HGTV and Food Network and now you've lost ABC-7," it continued, referring to a dispute earlier this year that kept the popular cable channels off Cablevision for about three weeks. "Enough is enough!" Then, at 12:01 a.m., WABC/Channel 7 went blank on Cablevision, leaving customers fuming. Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/oscars_blind_sided_sDG1iVbti7yonxjTLTtKBJ#ixzz0hVO3DBQd
mf
good morning folks: so, 1 & 2 the last 3 games, at that pace we go 6 2/3rds wins 13 1/3rd losses over the final 20.....Hopefully we pick up some talent in the draft......Ola, if you're correct about Sather moving to the center, maybe he'll let Torts go over the summer and try to bring in your boy Stevie Yzerman...
mf
"Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah," Tortorella said when the subject of Gaborik's injury was raised. "Obviously he needs to play better." Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/hockey/rangers/2010/03/06/2010-03-06_gaborik_no_help_rangers_shut_out.html#ixzz0hVK2H1iy .....this in need of an attitude adjustment coach needs to coach better, but he's oblivious to that fact. That's obvious TOO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!..................FIRE OR RETIRE SATHER TONIGHT ......................
stevielegs
sather has been outdone at times..."... Rick DiPietro was supposed to be when Mike Milbury traded Roberto Luongo, Olli Jokinen and either Marian Gaborik or Dany Heatley for him 10 years ago. Seems like a good topic for an intermission show on NBC, doesn't it? Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/more_sports/sid_blows_nhl_golden_chance_22VH7UimsoimIdQfehXQTJ#ixzz0hV4ZW6zx
stevielegs
lb...WASHINGTON -- Marian Gaborik returned and, with that, both head coach John Tortorella and the Rangers fell into familiar patterns that concluded in a 2-0 loss here last night to the Capitals. Given the opportunity to heap ice time on his top two lines with his lone elite goal-scorer in the lineup for the first time in four games, Tortorella couldn't resist, especially through the second half of the second period, during which the coach pretty much went with six forwards. No longer did Tortorella feel the need to roll lines, as he was almost forced into doing for the previous three games, during which the Blueshirts scored 13 goals. Nope, not with Gaborik back at his disposal, even if obviously not quite himself, skating almost gingerly with a sore groin that's not fully healed. Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/rangers/rangers_retreat_eybGEBGaMwQjP5ySUUqTgK#ixzz0hV317KSY
stevielegs
I will personally laugh my ass off with no abandon if Atlanta makes the playoffs and go farther than the Debbies.
DanyloHalytskyj
Torts style just isn't enough against the better teams.
Ola
Thought Auld played a great game and giving Henrick extra rest after the 50+ shot Pitt game was a good move. Other than the penalties and the 5 on 3 goal I thought we went toe to toe 5 on 5 for most of the game. Gaborik was not himself. I hope he gets well soon. Certainly not a given but if we do make the playoffs and everybody is healthy it will still be fun to watch and with Gaborik and Lundqvist you never know what can happen.
NetMan
Yep they need offense so he sits Lisin, and Shelly's job is to? He should be out nailing Ovechkin, but not with this coach. He's babling about penalties. The guy is full of it, mostly of himself . ....FIRE OR RETIRE SATHER RALLY PROTEST ,TOMORROW MARCH 7TH, 5PM..........@ MSG..........66 points and usually you need 90 . 24 out of 36 points , go whip them Tortorella, play Auld tomorrow too.
stevielegs
I think winning about 4 of the last 18 should get us into a decent spot. Make Gordie Clark the GM. Get us a coach with a clue. Getrid of the dead weight.
Bob
they have to win 10-12 out of 18, don't hold your breathe....
stevielegs
Well, that was a snoozer. Rangers never threatened, and Theodore could have had a shutout in a lounge chair tonight. Keep up the losing.....get a higher draft pick.
Bob
And by that I mean our 4th line is awesome :)
chinstrap
On the other hand, dressing Shelley in a game where the other team has no tough guys whatsoever is baffling. Especially with back to back, would much rather have Lisin or even Voros, who (never thought i'd say this) is a much better 'player' than Shelley. SHelley should play against Philly and any other team with goons or who have pushed us around. Thats it.
chinstrap
They've played Drury-Cally-Staal or Girardi on all 5 on 3's this year and for the most part, its worked.
chinstrap
so since when on a 5 on 3 do you play 2 forwards 1 d-man?
stevielegs
playing Auld instead of The King is absurd. Aul should have been tomorrow.
stevielegs
Gordie Clarke could draft rounds 6-7 and Maloney 1-5 and Clarke would get the better players.
DanyloHalytskyj
BTW, THN Future Watch issue is out and with some good news for a change for us beleagured Ranger fans. The Rangers have the 16th, 21st, 22nd and 67th overall rated prospect with Stephan, Grachev, Kreider and McDonagh respectively. They are rated 5th overall in the league as a team due to those 4, plus MDZ and AA. Interestingly enough, 4 of these kids (McDonagh and AA being the exceptions) were selected in the last 2 amatuer drafts - isn't that since Maloney left? Maybe this Gordie Clark dude knows what he's doing? He's the guy who seems to get all the soundbites when it comes to the Rangers amatuers.
RF4L
PATRICKDIV- Valentenko was already committed to play in Russia. He is still under contract, but I believe he was suspended by Montreal for not reporting to their farm team. Either that or they allowed him to play there but don't have to pay a salary. I like HEIKINEN as well, but at this point until either Rozy or Redden are gone, there is no room for another D-man, let alone another rookie.
ColoradoMark
Alex Auld gets his Ranger Debut tonight against Capitals
Higgy21
I think he's feeling the pressure. "People say'? What did he do in the 3rd period to win?
stevielegs
"You look at the shots, people will say we gave in," Tortorella said. "We did not give in. We tried like hell to try to win that hockey game. We played against some players that amped it up on us, and we did not have an answer in that third period. In the first and second periods, although the shots were lopsided, the chances were pretty much even. "We have had a very inconsistent year, but I think we understand how we have to play in this last quarter," he added. "They need to embrace it and I think they are." Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/rangers/gaborik_to_play_against_capitals_mKwwJMZbpyRAtC1amfSTyN#ixzz0hPX87JgS
stevielegs
cablevision & disney fighting over fees.............http://www.nypost.com/p/news/business/cablevision_hits_iger_AJ7R9aAfVTAaBP4jvPpXXK
mf
Rhet: Re Dubi - I think it's premature to say that about the kid. After all, he's just 23 and it's only his 3rd NHL season. Some guys don't mature until they are well into their mid-20s and even beyond. I think he's struggling to figure out what sort of player he is - he tries too hard, I think, to be something he's not. He's not a play making, puck distributing centerman. He's a strong on his skates, is mobile, can carry the puck and work the corners well. He's also got a very good shot that I think he doesn't use enough because he's often too busy trying to look to pass.
RF4L
NYS- Sather have a plan, but its very senior... Name centered. Get a coach who knows what it takes, and build for him. With that in mind, its pretty remarkable that he can like first go with a coach like Renney, who is extreme at one end, and then Torts who is extreme in another direction.... Hence we were forced to start over completely....
Ola
Speaking of eating our youth both Heikkenen and Valentenko are two D's that should have gotten a shot here.
PatrickDiv
Yeah and Manny will be the perfect age to retire (cough cough) I mean sign here.
NYStranger
Rhet - its not that Sather doesn't have a plan, it's just that he is constantly having senior moments!
NYStranger
RF4L... St. Manny is a UFA this year... :)
Rhet0ric
TD... We never commit to developing young players... It's something we've never been good at... we give them a couple of years and then we decide to trade them because they don't score enough, etc... my point is that if we had traded Malhotra in his first 2 years, we could've gotten a decent player for him... other examples are... Nicklas Sundstrom, Christian Dube... the list goes on and on... if we traded these guys early on we could've gotten pretty decent players in return for them... by the time we made up our minds on them, their value was next to nothing... we do the same thing with our minor leaguers... we've got to make up our minds on SANGUINETTI before we can get nothing back for him either.... The 2 things that we are pretty good at drafting are offensive D-men and 3rd line forwards... the problem is that we need to stop trying to turn the 3rd lines into top six forwards and we need and we need to trade the D while their value is still high... they can't all play for this team... For eg. if we sign VOLCHENKO... That's MDZ, STAAL and Volchenko all playing on the left side... say MCDONAGH is ready to move up, which player do we trade? We never have a plan... I dont ever have a problem trading a youg player, as long as we get back an equally young player that fills a need... but we always seem to fly by the seat of our pants... RF4L... I think DUBI has reached his potential... I doubt he'll ever be a top 6 forward...
Rhet0ric
TDCHI: obviously I will be pulling hard for San Jose which I think is an odds on favorite to win a cup. 3 solid and productive lines, a fast mobile defense that moves the puck quickly. Lethal powerplay, one of the best PK units in the NHL. Elite goaltender. There is a lot to like about them. That said, I would disagree with your assessment on Pittsburgh. I still see them as a solid threat and potential cup finalist. They do have 2 of the top 3 players in the NHL in their lineup. That is going to give them a lot of advantages. They seem to be able to overcome their weaknesses with pure skill. But if I were a betting man for the east, I'd go with Washington that seems to score at will. For giggles I will assume you are right with Pittsburgh and OV shakes the Crosby demon knocks out the Pens and goes to the finals. They face a San Jose team that just is tailor-made for shutting down a team like Washington.
E
http://www.mynhldraft.com/NHL-Mock-Draft/
mf
Going to see the Pack - Bulldog game tomorrow night at Copps, anyone else going ?
HamiltonHellhound
“I think I’ll be good to go for tomorrow. Obviously, there’s no situation like a game situation. Obviously, in a perfect world, I’d wait a little bit to get back at it.” However, Gaborik, said, he doesn’t have the luxury of time with 18 games left on the schedule. “I want to help this team right away.”
stevielegs
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/firesather/
stevielegs
td: I agree with you on your stance that the Rangers seem to discard their youth too early too often. I will take that a step further however, and say that all too often the Rangers don't create the proper environment for their youth to develop. When you look at the history of this club since about 97 onward, the reason for that becomes obvious: The organization seems to be in a constant state of flux as they continue their unsuccessful attempts at pseudo-rebuilding. If a kid doesn't show something quickly, he often gets shunted aside. I realize the team has several younger players now taking regular shifts, but other than the King, can we say any of these guys have developed to their potential? I say no, although there's still time for the likes of Staal, Cally and Dubi (and of course MDZ and Gilroy, seeing as they're rookies). The pressure to make the POs with a mediocre lineup is felt by the coaches I suspect and that is passed on to the players. IMO, it's not healthy and can serve to retard development significantly.
RF4L
Rhet: Re OJ playing well. It certainly didn't happen last night - the only thing that stood out for me about him happened (I think) in the 2nd period. He was in the neutrel zone carrying the puck, once again seeming to skate in mud, and a Penguin caught up to him, lifted his stick, and stole the puck. That's not the first time I've seen that happen in his short tenure with the Rangers so far. I can see the skill he has (actually Dubinsky and OJ share some traits in that regard - good skaters, strong on the puck with good shots), but I don't like what's between his ears. I don't see the passion. All that said, I share your concern about how Sather will approach him in the off-season. He's not worth anything over $3,000,000/per and with a short contract, too (like 2 years). I say if anyone offers him anything better, say bye-bye. I am convinced giving him anything longer than a 2 year contract will mean he becomes yet another in a pathetically long line of overpaid Ranger mercenaries.
RF4L
Rhet – the problem I see with the Rangers isn't necessarily that they hold onto pieces too long(at least with the big club). It's a combination of them drafting the best pick available instead of the best pick for the team and that when their picks don't pan out, they refuse to let them acclimate to roles that are fitting for them. With very few exceptions(Montoya being one)I really don't think you can say they hold onto guys too long...I tell you, I'd love to have MALHOTRA or DOM MOORE as our third-line center...And I wouldn't mind having LUNDMARK on fourth....no reason KORPIKOSKI couldn't be a decent checking-line winger...Hell, I wouldn't mind having Monty as a backup goalie...In fact, if you look at what these players are making and compare them with the other salaries originally penned in on these lines, they'd probably come up cheaper...and more effective..yet EVERY PLAYER I mentioned was literally given away...Malhotra for Lyshenko...Lundmark for Taffe...Montoya for Gratton, Leneveau and Sjostrom...Moore for Adam Hall...Korpikoski for Lisn, who is arguably the best return the Rangers have gotten from one of their picks....the bottom line though is that by the time the Rangers know they're lower-tier players, so do other teams....In the case of Dubinsky and Callahan, you have two forwards that have come up in the Ranger system and are proving to be effective NHLers. Both have second-line written all over them and I'd bet all of Hospo's beer that their names have been nearly omnipresent in trade offers to Sather...Mind you, they're the most successful Ranger forwards to play for the team, since Prucha, and before that, Mike York...and they're the only once that show promise to be more than third or fourth line grinders, which the aforementioned two ultimately became...Yet you want to trade them away for someone who may or may not have success on this team? I patently disagree. Go with the players you know, not the ones you don't. When Cally and Dubi become redundant pieces on this team, that's when you trade them. And not a minute sooner.
tdchi
REDDEN... according to a couple of unsubstantiated sources... the swap for SOURAY was a done deal, but put on the backburner as soon as the infection in his hand cropped up... I don't know any of the other pieces involved... Like the GOMEZ deal last year, if it's consumated in the summer, we'll know if it WAS REAL
Rhet0ric
RF4L... Agreed on LISIN... the kid needs to play in HARTFORD every day... we have done next to nothing with him since he's been here... NEWFIE... This entire team is built wrong... let's start with the Defense... too many offensive minded guys on this team that don't play very well defensively... both R&R boys need to go(obviously) one way or the other... GIRARDI can go too... we have better guys coming up in the system and he'll probably want too much $$$... we should trade him while he has value(RFA)... I would like to see us sign VOLCHENKO and put STAAL and GILROY back together... we also need to get a solid defensive conscience to play with MDZ... WHY WAIT to fix the D? we should scratch REDDEN more and bring up Illka Heikkinen... I would really like to get a good look at him before he leaves for RUSSIA for good... our TOP 6 Forwards are not great... I know guys love CALLY and DUBI, but if we have the chance to get 2 legit top 6 forwards for them, we need to do it... in the past we either traded youth for old vets or held on to youth too long and got little in return for them... we need to be aggressive and start making trades for the missing pieces... we need more scoring on this team... JOKINEN... I worry about this guy, he is getting hot at the right time, riding high after his Bronze medal... I could see us signing him to a big contract in the offseason and then watch him fade next year (the same way he did after he signed his last deal)... he just feels like one of those guys that we've signed so often in the past... I would much rather we go after TOMAS PLEKANEC...
Rhet0ric
stevie - I agree completely with 11-7. That's better than dressing Shelly. I still fail to understand WHAT a guy like that brings to the game. I'd take Prust, Ruutu, Cooke, Downie or Eager over a guy like that ANY DAY...E - The Penguins are going nowhere near another cup, mark my words. They blew their load last year, and while Ponikarovsky certainly makes them more dangerous, they lack the depth of teams like San Jose, Chicago or Washington. Their only hope is that Fleury gets REAL hot...And I think I touched on this earlier...but the best way to beat the Penguins is to challenge their role-players and maintain a physical presence against guys like Crosby and Malkin...The turning point of that game came when the Rangers let up on their physical play and let the Pens carry the puck. That's when they're skill guys are going to exploit the shit out of you..Seemed to me last night the Rangers made a pathetic attempt at trapping the Pens(something they're utterly incapable of doing anyway), and then simply tired themselves out with Torts riding two lines and two defensemen...Against other teams though, the Pens don't have either the defense or the depth to hold back juggernauts like Washington or Chicago. No way, no how. I predict the Pens will be on the golf course after the second round. Maybe even sooner...ANOTHER random thought about last night's game...seemed like after that bullshit call the Pens got for Marc Staal's hit on Crosby...that they really let up on him. There were some times when Crier had the puck and the Rangers were doing BS poke checks...now I know Sid is hard to knock off his skates, but he's not that hard. It just drives me mad that the stripes ALWAYS call a penalty whenever Crosby hits the ice. Every fucking time, pardon my french.
tdchi
RF4L: Last night in many instances they got caught looking. Pittsburgh moves the puck so damn well that you end up circling the wagons standing around a little shell shocked. The Rangers needed to expand out and force the play which clearly they could not do. They could not impose any will on the Pens at all. This was a case where the Rangers needed to attack. 1-man forechecks, and conservative play = death. The Rangers needed to get the puck deep and cycle. Take the chance that they will give up the odd man rushes. The Pens were going to get them anyway. I truly believe that the Rangers can match the Pens talent when it comes to defense, goaltending, and supplemental scoring. They just don't have the horses to handle the 2 scoring lines. And so you have to outwork them. But the truth is that the Rangers can bang, scratch, and crash doing all the yeoman's work to get one only to see Malkin or Crosby go up ice the next shift tic, tac, goal. There is a reason that they may win another Stanley Cup this season and maybe even next.
E
Hospo: His speed is arguably his top skill, but last night his passing was atrocious and try as he might, he kept missing with his bodychecks. I recall a stretch a few months back where he was forechecking very hard (hitting people) and actually generating offensive chances (mainly from firing off rockets at the net). Last night I thought, besides the speed, he accomplished nothing. In his defense, though, after about 5 minutes into the 2nd period, no one but the King accomplished anything for the Rangers.
RF4L
RF4L - I'll be hionest, I do not like Lisin at all....But watching him last night he used his speed rather well offensively Was more dnagerous then most... But he needs to become consistent and learn the other half of the game before he becomes significant.
Hospo
Not that he showed very much all season long, but the way LIsin played yesterday indicates to me that his head is totally screwed on backwards thanks, I suspect, to the way he's been handled by Torts. He plays a few games, then is pressboxed, then gets 5 minutes a game. He's been yo-yo'd about all season long. At one point, probably back before Christmas, he looked like he might be coming around, but has regressed to the point where I question even dressing him at all. The further this season goes the more unimpressed with Tortorella I become. Will he get fired if the Rangers don't make the POs? If so, there's another reason to hope for a non-PO finish.
RF4L
GRESCH--I am there. If the Rangers have to win in spite of the coach, we have a long way to go.
Bob
they'll be better off with 7d, and 11 forwards, especially with how he operates. Why he hasn't tells me he's got his system & philosophy, and he doesn't want to change. That's his method, his results are not very impressive.
stevielegs
I'd like to see the use of four lines aswell but the very make up of our forwards is starting to show the warts. Leaving Shelley and Voros out of the mix of 12 forwards , there are SEVEN centres? and only two right shots one of which is a centre (Drury). It is very hard to come up with legit line combos with this mix. We need some Real wingers on this team. It's allright in a short series like the Olympics to move centres to the wings to form lines but not over an entire NHL campagne. Just my opinion.
Newfie_Ranger
I agree with TDCHI about the line matchups and Torts screwing up by niot getting fresher legs out ther over the last half of the game..I would have love to seen Prust out there more...BOytano and Shelley are another story, but Torts dressed the,...Where I totally disagree is about us being "neck to neck " with them in the second...Not even close from about the 5 minute mark (despite the goal)..It was only a matter of time before the Pens caught up the way the Rangers were playing and being deployed...It just took to overtime because of The King...
Hospo
guess he got the memo and the paycheck....."Marian Gaborik practicing with team in regular jersey 22 minutes ago via web "....zip
stevielegs
td: Sorry, but I gotta disagree on your take the Rangers matched the Pens in the second. They did not. Fleury let in a bad goal (Rozey's) and for about 5 of the 20 minutes the Rangers played ok. I get the discrepancy in talent, but that doesn't excuse the discrepancy in effort. The Pens embarassed the Rangers in that regard (save for the King). I maintain that if things continue as is (and I see no reason to expect them not to) the King will eventually request a trade. And I wouldn't blame him 1 iota. Most nights he works his tail off - it must be frustrating to watch the team in front of him commit gaffe after gaffe. He's gonna break sooner or later.
RF4L
Bob - welcome to the "Tampa won in spite of Torts" fan club. Your free tshirt is in the mail, LOL......Dany - he's had that look on his face since day one, the guy is clueless and the game has passed him by but someone forgot to tell him.......Ola - you and York18 were one of the firsts to point out that Torts system wud fail, you guys called it from day 1.......tdchi - i was thinking the same thing last nite. If you go back and check the toi's in last yrs finals, you will see that both teams used all four lines regualarly. Torts just doesn't want to adjust or he can't. I don't know which one it is.
Greschner4
The officiating at MSG is an absolute f-ing joke. I don't know another barn in the league where the home team gets fisted more regularly than the Garden. That call in OT was an abortion. The call to put us 2 down as well. Makes me sick.
puckyou
I too am disappointed in Tortorella. He does not have the talent he needs to contend for a cup, but he sure doesn't use what he has intelligently. If the guys on the 4th line cannot play, find someone who can. He had some pretty darn good talent in Tampa when he won there. I am now wondering if they won in spite of him instead of becasue of him. Oh well, I feel sorry for Hank, but the losing needs to continue. We need a good draft position this season.
Bob
Personally, I think TORTORELLA coached the Rangers out of that game...Having watched everything but the OT period, I can say the Rangers played neck-and-neck for two periods of that game, despite the shot disparity. But by the third, Torts reverted to his usual 'skate two lines and two defensive pair' BS. He was constantly trying to match up his best players with Cindy, so Bylsma simply double-shifted the little prick...Ditto with Slew, who is really coming into his own as the number-2 dounchebag in the NHL...The end result? That game was a match between the Rangers' best players and the Penguins best players. And guess who's going to come out on top in that match? The key to beating clubs like this is to beat them by rolling four lines...SHELLEY should NOT have been in that game. Like I said earlier, he's not as slow as BRASHEAR...but that's like comparing the flowof molasses at room temperature to how it moves on a cold winter day...IMO, BYERS should be the winger on fourth line, not these stupid f'ing goons...BTW....I love looking at the box score after the game to see how much ice time is pursed out...On the Pens, only JAY MCKEE skated under 9 minutes...On the Rangers, the whole fourth line skated under 6 minutes...On the Pens, which skated seven defensemen, only McKee skated under 15 minutes. On the Rangers, both GILROY and REDDEN skated under 15 minutes(14 and 12 respectively). YOU CAN'T PURSE OUT ICE LIKE THAT AGAINST SUPERIOR TOP-LINE TALENT. PERIOD...Why you ask? Because a bottom line plucker will stand a chance a better chance against Crosby with fresh legs than anyone of the Rangers' top line players after skating 23 minutes....Sorry, but that game could have gone either way. It was TORTORELLA who forced it in the direction it eventually went.
tdchi
Ola I agree if you are saying this team would be better if Tortorella was doing a better job of coaching.
stevielegs
Stevie - for all of us (me) clamoring for a top 5 pick- Torts just keep doing what your doing. "If your are not even close to being a contender then you might as well really suck", is my motto.
NYStranger
Dandenault released from Hartford. He has been injured for most of the time. Ericcson is the vet replacement.
gene_carr
Vic - you mean the MSG video production crew was making something out of nothing? Never! Wash your mouth out with soap before the media nazis come for you. LOL It's like that movie 'Wag the Dog' only here the Dog is the Rangers.
NYStranger
DAN you hit it, he doesn't adjust his game, nor did he adjust the players. He let that 3rd period just happen.All he does is sit his lower guys, and ride the others. At least Renney had the 4th line do a number on crybaby, part of the game. I don't even remember a timeout being used. And there was no need to keep Potter up and dress 7D in the managements' minds. Just trade for an old D man and send him to Hartford, and give up a pick, genius. .......HEY they got a point ...!.........and Gaborik will be back soon.........
stevielegs
OLA: They didn't show large stretches of the 2nd or 3rd. They only popped in to show you Ranger scoring chances and Pens goals for the most part.
Vic
Not only do we have a problem with Sather. We have a big problem with Tortorella. All worries I had about him when we got him have come true. When we had Renney people said -- "why can't we just play offensive minded hockey instead of defensive minded hockey?" And I said that you can't cheat in the game today. If you don't play well defensively. If you aren't good enough to take the puck out of your own end and get it into the attacking zone -- you just won't spend much time in the attackingzone. And you know what, if anything, thats what we have seen under Tortorella. If you can catch a team on a bad night, you can blitz them. Heck, Atlanta played like we did now 3 years ago and won their division. The NHL isn't that good. But against a good team you need to be able to carry the play. And the only way you are able to carry the play against a good team today that is by constantly trying to hang on to the puck. Tortorella on the other hand, he is preaching a no misstake, straight lines, fast transition game. The results are that we won't see a Marek Malik as often try to go D to D and we will see much fewer big misstakes. BUT, we will also give the puck away, without even being pressured, a helluva lot more. With that style, we will NEVER be able to match up against a Pittsburgh or Washington when they are playing well. We are a lot easier to play against for good teams with Tortorella behind the bench. We won't struggle as much like away or home against Florida as we did with Renney. We won't see as many "win-the-shots-with-40-20-but-still-loose-the-game-against-a-worthless-team"-nights. But we have very little potential. Or no potential really. Well well. What else is new, we are Fed.
Ola
I made it home to catch the 3rd and instead of tightening up defensively and holding our blue line up 4-2 they were foolishly going deep and pinching and getting caught. Even after getting overrun in the first 5 minutes of the period they continued to do the same thing. It was mind boggling. And Torts is starting to develop the Renney clueless glare like he doesn't know what's happening.
DanyloHalytskyj
Throw 90% of the other team's in the league's starter in that game last night and we lose 10-4.
DanyloHalytskyj
VIc- I've not seen one second of the game, but that part of the game -- the 3rd period -- where they outshot us 19-1 can't possibly have been all that close, could it? ;)
Ola
I was nailed by the Versus blackout last night so I only got to watch the Rangers in 60. The MSG production crew did a fantastic job of splicing together the game to give me the "true" impression of how it was played. I don't know what you guys are talking about. It was a great game that was pretty evenly played. A see-saw affair where we matched them skill-for-skill, power-for-power. It could have gone either way as we were matching them chance for chance for most of the game. On the OT goal it looked like HANK may have been a little off guard from not having faced too many quality scoring chances during the game. I don't know if I will be able to catch the game against Washington. If not I may just watch the Rangers in 60 again instead of taping the game. After all, they give me all the info and action I need to know........
Vic
Vinny Prospal said the Rangers needed to “play a little harder as a team to keep pucks out of our zone.”
stevielegs
gross..."Coach John Tortorella called it an ugly point but a point nonetheless and I guess that’s how you have to look at this game. But, it seems to me, it’s quite disturbing that you start out with four goals on 12 shots, even with the shot differential so huge, and then manage just four more shots the rest of the game. One shot in the third period, none in overtime."....."“It’s every game,” defenseman Michael Del Zotto said. “It’s been like that all year, he’s been standing on his head. Unfortunately, we couldn’t get two points but it’s still a big point for us. They just had the puck in our end the whole time.”....and oink claimed they are now playing playoff hockey......
stevielegs
And it's not really torture - it's frustrating for sure, but unlike when I was a kid and following this team, I vent (on here mainly) and that's it. I don't throw things around (my poor transistor radio got tossed about like a dwarf in an Aussie bar dwarf throwing contest) and I don't rant and rave after the game's over. It's all good. And when the Rangers play well, it's a pleasure.
RF4L
mf: Sorry, that post to Bob was meant for you...
RF4L
funniest hockey fight.....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSqZfnvjq3Y
stevielegs
“It’s getting there,” Gaborik said. “I hope to skate again tomorrow. I skated this morning and it felt pretty good. Hopefully it’s getting better and better.”
stevielegs
GROSS..."...John Tortorella on tonight’s game… “Hank was outstanding and gave us an opportunity. We will look at some things - what we did good, what we did wrong. At the end of the night, we grabbed a point out of here. Although it is an ugly one, it is a point. We will take that and go to Washington tomorrow.” Chris Drury on tonight’s game… “We’ll take the point and learn from it and get ready for a heck of a Washington team. We’re obviously getting down to it, we have 19 games left. Everything kind of gets more physical, a little more nasty as the season progresses, especially within the division.” Brandon Dubinsky on tonight’s game… “We did find a way to get a point and points are important. Especially for us right now at this time of the year. We will take them any way we can get them. Like I said, we just have to tighten up defensively and we’ve obviously shown we can put a few more in the net than we have been previously. If we just take care of our zone we’ll be fine.”
stevielegs
For those of you who may have missed Academy Award winner Cindy Crybaby falling down... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSRGyeS44zA
Tikkanen
next time we play Pittsburgh we should have Avery on the ice every time crosby steps on. How we play Avery, Shelley, and Prust and Crosby comes out a bully is beyond me.
Messier11
Jim,Hospo.I doesn't matter how talented pens are you had you're u by two and at this stage and in the dog fight it should be enough to beat anybody you should be able to win the game .
ilya
Damn, as undeserving point a team can get...but it's a point neverthelsess..Get the good stuff out of the way first, The King was unbelivable but left out to dry...I missed the first period so I obviously missed the "good" Rangers but he team that played the rest of the game had its' head up its' ass and got away from everything they were doing right the past 4.5 games..A total meltdown. and a total disgrace.....Yes, the very good Pens forced things but, cmon, show some balls, brains and restraint and play smart hockey with your best player out..
Hospo
Bob: I purposely don't avoid watching, but for sure as the season's worn on if there's something else to do, I don't miss this frustration. I missed the Ottawa game because I was out of town and while I pleased to read about the effort, I didn't lament missing the game because I was certain the clunker put forth tonight was forthcoming. The Caps are up next - I hope the King is ready!!!
RF4L
chin: Well, I come on here regardless of how the team is doing and post appropriately. Lately, the negativity on here outweighs the positive because that's what this team is all about. Unless you call for 4 years running fighting for the 8th PO spot only to be promptly eliminated if you make it positive. It was 4 years ago - for me now it's frustrating, especially when I can see what really needs to be done. For me, the only solution is to stop being a fan, but alas, so far, my loyalty to this team, which borders the ridiculous I know, is stopping me from doing that. Eventually, if the situation doesn't change, I will - in the meantime, what can I say?!
RF4L
I have already skipped games this season. Very unusual for me. We are on the elevator downward. Everyone around us has improved, and we have not. Add to this a coach who is a blowhard and a bully with poor results, and a GM who the game passed by 10 years ago, and why get emotionally involved?
Bob
You know things are bad when Chris Drury has as many goals as Mike Rupp...
rosch2000
RF: The answer is years away.......Please stop torturing yourself, I for 1, dont watch the games anymore, I just check the Wall..... good luck...
mf
Atlanta is equal in points to the NYR....what a freakin joke.......
stevielegs
If I had the solution, I'd be rich. Just seems like some people only come on here to complain and never to give any credit, not that much is deserved tonight.
chinstrap
chin: Mmm...so what's the solution to close the gap in skill?
RF4L
No. 5 million.
chinstrap
Just to review: The Rangers were outshot 55 to 16. Are the Pens 3 and 1/2 times more talented?
RF4L
RF4L--Shocking that we get outplayed by a team thats 5 million times better than us.
chinstrap
Higgy...meaning Redden's here to stay.
RF4L
Redden's soon to be a Charlotte Checker if Sather grows some balls
Higgy21
chin: Come on...the Rangers were outplayed in the 2nd too - outshot 17 to 7. They were only in the game because the King was awesome and Fleury sucked. 2 of New York's goals were weak. The Rangers started well (in the first) then just faded away, starting late in the first. Yes, Pittsburgh is more skilled but the lack of effort from this club after the first is inexcuseable. PO bound my ASS!
RF4L
Drury and Girardi also played great games.
Higgy21
they miss Gaborik, but thems the breaks, and they give the pens 2 points, and only get 1. They could have gotten 2 and none for the pens. ....and milkin is a dirty player who purposely swings his skates at guys.
stevielegs
I know most people will point to getting severely outplayed in the 3rd, but what do you expect? We played the champs without our best player and still were right there at the end. Yeah, the 3rd sucked, but we're a flawed team, especially without Gabby. I NEVER complain about the reffing, but that call on Redden in OT was an embarrassment. THey let shit go the whole 3rd. Calls like that which lead to wins and losses makes a mockery of the NHL. I miss hockey in the 80s and early 90s when the players decided the games.
chinstrap
DCI: He's stumbling over the pathetic lack of effort from him teammates.
RF4L
And Shitiletti saying it was a deserved point for the Rangers? OMG, bend over a little more you ass-kissing idiot. The only Rangers who came to play more than 1 period was the goalie, a goalie who inevitably will be looking for a trade if/when this team's endless mediocrity gets to him. And it will.
RF4L
I see The King stumbling into the locker room like Denis Lemieux
DCIGolfer
Well the deserving team won. A pathetic display of effort and talent courtesy of the New York Rangers. And why we don't want this team to blow it all up is beyond me. The talent disparity is obvious (save for the goaltender), but the refusal to play smart, disciplined hockey is excuseable. And typical.
RF4L
OMG, the King is 1 man team. Truly.
RF4L
OMG, the disparity in talent is sooo evident in the 4 on 4. The Rangers cannot complete a pass for the life of them and the Penguins tick tack toe all over the place. Nice job Sather...let's keep being mediocre - it's sooooooooooooo much fun!
RF4L
Torts is a dope. How much worse could the guys he glued to the bench have done? 19-1on shots. Hank has saved their butts tonight.
Bob
A VERY undeserved point. What a shameful display of hockey. Nice job Sather. Excellent roster manipulation Tortorella. Both suck.
RF4L
Pittsburgh is winning EVERY battle and of course blow-hard Tortorella has guys like Shelley and Prust glued to the bench. 50 shots now for Pittsburgh. Outshot 18 to 1 for the 3rd. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.
RF4L
NYStranger: The Pens, who are ridiculously more talented, woke up. And stone cold Fleury got pulled (why the Pen coach would sit him for their first game back when he sat the entire Olympics is beyond me) and Johnson made a couple of good saves and that was it for the crappy Rangers. BTW, where is that $5,500,000 man OJ? OMG, Sather had better not resign him in the off-season. This guy screams prototype Ranger mercenary...
RF4L
cnp: That's because the Pens, after the first, are totally dominating the game and when you have that many shots and overwhelm the team that much, goals simply go in. And imagine - the Rangers squeaking into the POs to get humilated like this in the opening PO series? What the phuck is the point??? Blow this piece of crap up!
RF4L
I'm thinking the Rangers either have been paid off to throw this game or were forced to eat turkey during the 2nd intermission! WTF?
NYStranger
RF4L: Allright after watching this period I will have to agree with u..The Pens are just a more talented team. It seems like the Pens always get goals off Ranger skates. That's 2 in this game.
cnparda
45 shots to 12? How utterly pathetic.
RF4L
Rangers will lose this game...pretty predictable IMO..
RF4L
BTW, why are the Rangers allowing Fedetenko to face wash all night without retribution??? Will someone take this punk out please!
RF4L
Third period starts and the Rangers immediately give up back to back odd man rushes. Yes, that's the way to push to the POs!!!
RF4L
cnp: Sorry, not this period. The Rangers are on their heels and playing horribly. Fluery left because 2 of the 4 goals were ridiculously soft. They survived the second (being outshot something like 25 to 12) because of the King. I get the talent disparity (comes from drafting high for a few years) but losing the puck because you're skating in mud and get your stick lifted is inexcusable, IMO. It's happened twice in this game that I saw.
RF4L
RF4L: I think u are being a tad harsh. The rangers are still playing hard, just not as smart as the first period. I think you need to look at the fact the Rangers w/o Gabby have chased two goalies in a row. Means nada if you don't win but the Rangers are proving they can score when they outwork their opponent.
cnparda
Well, I see which team showed up for the 2nd...the shit Rangers. Unbelievable - no passion, hand-aways, missed assignments, weak on the boards play. Ridiculous. The 4 2 lead is an illusion!
RF4L
Well, I see which team showed up for the 2nd...the shit Rangers. Unbelievable - no passion, hand-aways, missed assignments, weak on the boards play. Ridiculous. The 4 2 lead is an illusion!
RF4L
I don't know what I hate more: The penguins or their announcers.
cnparda
from carp..."...Marian Gaborik is definitely out, and John Tortorella sounds perturbed about it (although it’s almost impossible to know when he’s perturbed and when he’s not). “He’s not playing,” Tortorella said. When asked if it might be serious, Tortorella snapped, ”(Trainer Jim Ramsay) is going to tell me when he’s ready to play. He’s not playing tonight.”.....perturbed ?......why?.........
stevielegs
NYStranger: Agreed on the Dubi penalty - and it was goal against due to Rozey's slash that put the team 2 teams down. How interesting is it that Dubi's penalty came after the King went after Crosby? Love that move by the King - he's a leader and needs to show it.
RF4L
Now that was one feisty period of hockey and EXACTLY the way a team that's tight and together and has chemistry should play. When that happens, the whole is always greater than the sum of the parts. The key is this: What team shows up for the 2nd period? And the next game? And next week?
RF4L
Love Dubi protecting Lundqvist even if it ended up a PP goal against. The CAP sucks plain and simple - you get teams (like the Knicks but there are many others in all the leagues) that are not trying to compete but just run out years to get out from under salaries. You might argue that it is the GMs fault for making bad signings and they should know better but good players sign big contracts and suck as well. We as fans should NEVER have to endure such BS like Knicks fans are enduring right now. The answer is simple - do it like the NFL did - get rid of guaranteed contracts. Do it like the first year is guaranteed but then a play can be released without penalty. They are free to sign elsewhere. Something like this MUST happen soon in all sports because free agency and guaranteed contracts have killed pro sports and will continue to erode sports.
NYStranger
Td: agreed on Dubi on the Rw, and Drury has always been more comfortable on the LW.... To say something positive, OLI appears to be a solid signing (even if I did post "trade em all") I'll again refer to a post by "E" several weeks ago (eloquently stated) , Oli is playing for a contract, Oli is a bonafide 2nd line center, the Rangers have him in the right position, (thank the lord) and we've plugged 1 doughnut. "E's" post refered to several peripheral positions falling into place as a result of Oli's signing. If Joki stays consistent, I'd want him back, naturally, we need to watch the purse-strings.....On another note, interesting articles on the Knicks, with the GM taking responsibility on moves of the past and telegraphing the future. They are just so much more in the press than the Rangers.... "Glennie boy, this is NY, we thrive on news!" .... Also on the CAP, seems like the NFL may be ditching the damn thing, interesting comparing the cap situations of different sports... Me thinking "Butthead" may try to tinker with it....Time will tell... Watch Ola chime in with a Capology report and funky math >:) oh my!
mf
"Torts: Gaborik out, no further comment 27 m ago By Steve Zipay In his pre-game briefing, coach John Tortorella repeatedly would not go further than that. He declined to even say that Gaborik, who will miss his second straight game, was improving. So,. read between the lines. The Rangers' leading scorer isn't improving. He'll probably be out for the weekend back to backs, with the earliest return perhaps on Wednesday in New Jersey."
stevielegs
TDCHI - I Agree, the Rangers have been playing good hockey their last 5 games without Gabby and Del Zotto...Everybody pitching in, keeping the game simple and straight forward, reducing offensive and defensive mistakes..At least somebody else rcognizes how abysmaal Del Zotto was on defense...I don't mind him sitting (and learning) one bit for a little while..Just wish we had better options
Hospo
Darn game is on Versus tonight. I wish Bettman would take a break from hyping Crosby and sniffing Ed Snider's underwear to lay down the law about this stupid "no Vs. on DirecTV" thing. This really is idiotic, and an example of how Bettman really does not give a crap about fans.
Bob
Hey stevie, is there anything you're not angry about? Everything is some kind of slight to you. Seems like you're only a fan for the privilege of getting to complain (and also give "clever" nicknames). Knocking Gaborik for playing in the Olympics and getting injured? Yeah, there's obviously a real character problem there. We better get him off the team in a hurry.
ScMePlz
Bob/mf – Strange has it may seem, the Rangers have actually played MUCH better without GABORIK in the lineup since he went out four games ago. They're playing much more like a team, and a lot less like a hapless group almost solely reliant upon his scoring touch. I would add that this improvement also comes with the omission of MDZ, who was nothing short of a defensive travesty prior to HIS injury...NOW...I'm not saying for one minute that I think the Rangers are better without Gaborik...but that his absence has really helped some of the cusp players elevate their games...First and foremost, CALLAHAN has been given A-line time and thrived with it. Likewise, CHRISTENSEN has made the best of a bad situation and seems to have a very good chemistry with Cally...Dubinsky, like many have said, looks more comfortable on the wing and is more dangerous with a guy like Jokinen as a pivot...another MAJOR change is in the coaching...TORTORELLA was hammering Gaborik with time and really turning this into a one-line team...now he has no choice but to roll three lines and hopefully four tonight, if Shelly is a scratch like he should be. Prospal-Christensen-Cally, Drury-Jokinen-Dubinsky, Lisin-Anisimov-Avery, and Voros-Boyle-Prust would be my winner...Shelley, while no Brashear on the ice, still isn't fast enough to make an effective fourth-line...IMO, that lineup is one that has defensively aware players on every line...needless to say, though...we'll see tonight. But I wouldn't write them off just because Gaborik is out.
tdchi
MF---right you are. That would be the point. Good draft position is likely. Maybe even a new GM. Maloney is looking to be a pretty good GM, and is nowhere near that cap.
Bob
Bob: no Gabby, no playoffs..... the remaining schedule is not a breeze.... Has Sather died yet?
mf
Gabby needs to rest for the next 19 games or so and get healthy. he an return for the playoffs.
Bob
zip..."...Gaborik out tonight, and probably a bit longer. From the Slovakian games I saw, he was not 100 percent, and was reinjured in late second period vs. Canada. "....guess the playoff race not as important, rest up you're a star. Show those kids priorities. Get your pay from your homeland. ........
stevielegs
As a Rat's Ass (or is that Ass-rat) I take offense to your comment. I'm calling PETA! ;-)
Vic
I won't go on and on about this, because RF4L made the case that I agree with. I wanted more picks, and I wanted the team to bottom out and get a better pick. What is likely now is an 8th seed and blowout by Washington, or a near miss and a pick #14. Not hot or cold, but lukewarm.
Bob
VIC: I could give a rats ass about waht players are "known for" most of the time. Since Prospal has been a Rangers he hasnt taken shifts off...and he plays hard. Dont forget, MOST of what players are known for is simply BS. Lindros was spossed to be a cancer in the locker room, and once he was a Ranger all we herd was good things. Also, I am not saying a vet can give a palyer work ethic, but if a young palyer sees a guy who puts in just enough to get buy, they think thats all they need to make it in the NHL, but if they see guys who put in huge amounts of effort every day, and during the off season it gets them in the mind set that they need to push themselves their entire career. Its their natural work ethic that lets them do it, but no matter how good a work ethic you have if no one shows you what to do, you cant do it.
Wildcard
Wildcard- How good would Datsyuk be today then if Florida had drafted him? Of course, that can't be answered. Or its at least impossible to prove any argument made. I think he gained tremendously from getting to be drafted by Detroit. Kind of like Bäckström in Washington. He is a great player today.
Ola
gene_carr: I wanted the Rangers to be in play for Wolski but its OK with me we didn't get him.
E
Evets1980: I apologize by calling your post schizo. It was not meant to offend but more so, seemed to be a little bit hyperbole. You have absolutely no evidence other then historical that this team will continue to ride mediocrity. In fact, my entire argument has been (and one that this wall cried out for somewhere in the realm of 12 years) that a youth movement and development of a core base would break the very cycle of mediocrity. So, I ask: was everybody wrong on the youth movement? And what is this obsession for trading everybody for a pick no matter where it is? Has anyone looked at ratios of success in later rounds of the NHL draft. I have no empirical data but my perception as many others would agree have not been nearly as stellar as we think. If teams were tossing around high draft picks then why aren't we seeing them changing hands all that much yesterday. A few yes, but be realistic here. Teams draft and then release or trade rights to tons of them every year. Sure, you find some talent in there but to take current roster players (and ones that are keeping the team somewhat competitive and then tanking the team) for the purposes of lower round draft picks makes limited sense. And this obsession or belief that some have developed that we should dump Jokinen for anything is kind of silly to me. You practically steal a guy whose upside is far superior to the players that went the other way. You dress him for 5 games and he looks like a change of scenery could be something he needed and BOOM you want to turn him around for any pick you can get for him? And if he doesn't work out, you let him walk at no consequence. Where was the downside on this trade? We needed a center. People railed about the need all season and bitched that we would never be competitive without one. We got one no harm, no foul. As for Gaborik, if you don't think that you could get another 40-50 goal sniper on the open market for less then 7.5m then I think you should take a closer look at the UFA market. What do you think Kovalchuk is going to get? What did Hossa get? What do you think Datsyuk would get? Gaborik may be more injury prone and that is a valid argument but I would be interested to see some historical evidence. I never suggested that we have oodles of talent for the future but we are building a solid foundation for the next few years. Do I think we need more top end talent? Of course we do... But so does everyone in the NHL. Bottom line to me is if you think our youth movement is shallow and lacking in skill or capability, then you need to go back to the philosophy of UFA's. Or you could scrap the current roster of limited-talents draft for 5 years down the road and call for patience while they develop. I am sorry, but if we aren't going to go the youth movement then I am done with the Rangers permanently. I have the Sharks out here and I will tell you this: every year they make the playoffs, every year they incorporate youth, every year they incorporate good UFA's. Every year they seem to have a shot at the cup. Every year they dominate their home ice. But to me they will never have the romantic appeal of an original 6 franchise who I grew up with and have so many memories with. But without a youth movement, I am done with them. They have consumed too much of my time. Finally, I am enjoying watching them again.
E
I have little doubt Sather was going for Pheanuf & Kovalchuk. But who knows what really happened ? He doesn't. His results are like him, mediocre.
stevielegs
Well I see nothing has changed much since I took a break from everything Ranger related to care for my newborn. This organization doesn't care about giving us fans anything to hope for. I agree with some of you that this year should have been a year to get some prospects from the likes of OJ and Prospal. It just made sense but i know it can't happen cause then the seats would be empty come april at the Garden.......Hospo - I agree, the Rangers with Dolan as owner and Sather as GM only care about making the playoffs, even if it's only for 1 round. They will always build a team that is just good enough to make the 1st round maybe the second round if everything falls into place. You hit it on the nail with your previous post about the one year the team was built for it and all Sather did was get Backman and Shoestrom. I think (my opinion mind you) it was that decision that made JJ think twice about getting his numbers the following yr. He saw the writing on the wall and wanted out. Can't blame him, when you really thing about it.
Greschner4
TDCHI - "TEAMS WANT TO WIN"..I agree and why I knew there would be no dismantling or selling by the Rangers...Unfortutnately, Sather and the Rangers don't want to win bad enough.....Either in the present (going for it--where we have bought more on top of Jkinnen) or setting a goal of winning in the long term future (tearing it down)..The moves by Sather over the years both in the off-season and at the trade deadline only conform this warmed over middle of the road bull shit approach....Stuck in he middle with Sather..Just cut off my ears now and get it over with....
Hospo
WILD: You are kidding, right? OJ and PROSPAL both were notorious for not playing hard through most of their careers and OJ has the added reputation of being bad in the room especially with kids. These are not poster-child character players that we are talking about. Now, DRURY does have a greatreputation so shouldn't the kids be able to absorb his hard-working aura? I would argue that just as skill is something that you either have or do not have there are other aspects of a person's personality that you either have or you do not have. It doesn't matter how big you are if you don't have it in you to play a physical game. There have been countless examples of guys who were huge but did not like contact and did not play a physical game. There are equally as many guys who are small but play like monsters. We have examples of both already on this roster. Similarly, you either are born and raised with elite work ethic or you are not. It is very rare to see a kid/teen with poor work ethic find it later in life. Usually, you either have it in you by then or you don't.
Vic
RF4L: To what end do they make the kids better? Well If we are lucky, really really lucky, Sather will be gone in a year, and a new GM will have kids who know how to work hard in teh NHL and have the right mentality, that would give the team a chance to build the right way. The right atitude makes players "look" better, and they can get more in trades if they need to be mvoed, and they will help bring that "it" to the locker room as the team moved forward. Not giving that to young players would make it even worser for a new GM taking over, and the mentality would be that of laziness and not of hard work. I by no means think that either should be signed for more than 2 years, I would like to see 1 year, and maybe just one of them, but those things depend on what Sather can do with the UFA market and trades int he offseason. I jsut dont want to see kids way over their heads as much as possible. SO a year of two of OJ and Prospal would help with that.
Wildcard
E- Couldn't agree more with your take....RF4L and all...I explained this a while back with Ken...YOU CAN'T TAKE AN ABOVE .500 TEAM AND BLOW IT APART. It doesn't happen, simply put. Not at least at the trade deadline. I'm reaching back into the memory banks and I can't think of one instance where that happened. Teams that get dismantled are teams that failed from the get-go or have had injury-riddled seasons ride them to the cellar...the ONE possible exception is the THRASHERS this year with KOVALCHUK and LEHTONEN getting dealt. But even there, it was a stretch to say that team was going far...TEAMS WANT TO WIN. It's a real anomaly when they don't(Shittsburgh, circa 2004)...I also agree with OLA - The last thing you want to do with a hockey club is breed a culture of negativity...I defy someone to answer me this: What does it say to a 21-year-old kid on team at the cusp of making the playoffs when the GM abruptly trades away the top winger and center or even more? It says the organization doesn't care about winning and it's OK to tank it once in a while. And that's a very dangerous message to send a kid that age...NOW...what would have those guys gotten as a return? Who knows. The most either of them would have gotten was a pair of picks...Jokinen MIGHT have scored a prospect...Prospal I doubt would have gotten anything other than a second rounder....The latter will certainly be back...say at $2.5 million for a one-year deal...OJ, however, will want a long-term deal...I bet four-years at $5 million per would get him to sign. Whether he will get that from Sather is a factor of what STEPAN does after having his best NCAA/hockey season ever. If he goes back to school, look for Slats to hire a new center...there are some decent names out there...PLEKANEC for one...that he might be able to get cheaper than OJ...the sports writers already talk about him like he's gone though...Another thing about the DEADLINE...The devil will be in the details, IMO...if Sather didn't make moves because he values this core, he also won't look to dismantle the team come mid-june. And that's my real concern right now. At this point, I build around this team(in order of importance): Hank, Gaborik, Callahan, MDZ, Staal, Dubinsky, Anisimov, Drury, Gilroy, Boyle, Avery Prust, and Girardi. If there's money for it, add OJ and Prospal in there...In the offseason, do whatever it takes to free up one of the two money pits on defense(preferably Redden), and bank on filling roster spaces with kids. Top on my list of course is the duo from Wisconsin: Stepan and McDonagh. I'd also give Dale Wiese and Dane Byers a real hard look. And at last, just make Chad Johnson the backup...I think that's a solid team that's young with a huge upside if the kids this year develop...But knowing Sather, about a third of the players I just listed will be gone.
tdchi
Vic : A player can only go as far as his tallent will take him. Datsuk wont make Byers an allstar. And Sakic didnt make Hedjuk(sp) a top line player, teh dukes skills got him there, a player who isnt that great skill wise can help a top end skilled guy become a great player, it happnes in every sport. If you think that a hard working attitude does nothing to help bring kids along you are out of touch with how guys liek Sakic and Datsuk got were they are in the NHL, they had to work hard every day, and tehy can learn to do that from ANY player on the ice. SO by your standard, YASHIN would be better for the young players on the Rangers than Prospal or Drury...and thats just plain stupid, The PERFEC thing would be a guy who can show a young player exactly how to do it, like Sakic did for years, but you cant discount a player like Prospal or Drury in helping a high end tallent develope.
Wildcard
HOSPO he's putting the ball is the coach's court. If they don't make it, he just might axe him. The guy is all about cya, hence middle of the road after being stuck with BIG mistakes that he has a hard time correcting. He gambles too much . And we're stuck with him, waiting to get lucky.
stevielegs
Why would they trade Lang he is a cheap vet presence fnd they are in a good position to make some noise and made the necessary moves by adding some d in their playoff run.
DanyloHalytskyj
Hmmm, about yesterday..Anybody was fooling themselves if they thought guys like Redden and Roszy and their ridiculous contracts could be moved....And you also knew that Sather indeed has to make the POs and that's why other vets (Prospal, etc.) were't going anywhere either, especially on the heels of the Jokinnen trade......Basically came down to wheter or not Sather sacrificed prospects and picks for more immediarte help....Fortuntely, the only damage was picking up the rotting sack of flesh known as Anders Ericksson for a 7th rounder...Could have been worse....OTOH, it absolutley sucks the it is the goal of Sather and this organization just to make the POs for appearances....Been saying this for years, I hate this middle of the road Bull shit...Either tear it down or go for it....Sather did neither yesterday, just like he has the past few years...Still galls me remembering when this team had a real chance to go far in the POs a few years back and Sather traded for Christian backman and Mr. Zero Freddy Sjostrom....Oh well, bridge under water...Hope the te team keeps up its' recent strong play tonight....I would have really loved some jam on the defense (the forwards seem fine)
Hospo
DanyloHalytskyj - Yeah, but you didn't see PHX trade Robert Lang either. I love how PHX is looking. Trading OJ? I wouldn't have minded that either. But, we don't have anyone to replace him with. If we moved him, Anisimov would have been in over his head. Guys like Hanzal aren't in over their heads in PHX.
Ola
Sorry WILD, I don't buy that. Mediocre players don't help to make kids great players. Mediocre players help to make kids mediocre players. PROSPAL and OJ are MEDIOCRE players. They are not DYATSUK, ZETTERBERG, VL, SAKIC, MESSIER, LEMIEUX, etc.....
Vic
RF4L: I'm right there with you and I don't know if you recall but I was the guy SCREAMING that the Rangers needed to move JJ, NYLANER and STRAKA at the deadline 18 months before JJ became a UFA. The deadline deals that were being made that year were flat out stupid. The Rangers could have gotten a ton of picks and prospects for those three AND could have bottomed out to draft higher that year. I said it then that the Rangers were wasting a golden opportunity to rebuild the team the right way and that they would never win with JJ, NYLANDER and STRAKA.
Vic
wild: Yeah, maybe Prospal does make the kids better...but to what end result? The Rangers are still mediocre - they are still in a titanic struggle to make the POs, where they'll surely be quickly bounced. Worse, there isn't a top skilled forward in the mix - no matter how well the kids do under Prospal's tutelage, where's it gonna get the team???
RF4L
Vic: Don't get me wrong - I'd have been happy to see Mr Mediocre trade away Prospal and OJ for picks, but like I said, not so much because of the dual 2nds they might have fetched, but because it would signal to the team that management has tossed in the towel for the season. That in turn, would have likely resulted in the team bottoming out and a very high seeding in the draft pool. This is what this organization desperately needs and what should have been done 3 years ago. Imagine where we might be if that had occurred? One or 2 of the kids drafted in 2007 (ie Kane, Gagner, Alzner, Van Riemsdyk, etc) might very be wearing Ranger colours now. And a lousy 07 might easily have been matched in 08 and look at the bevy of burgeoning stars from that draft class - Stamkos, Doughty, Bogosian, Myers, Hodgson, etc. Plus any prospects that might have been fetched. For me, it's unbelievably frustrating to ponder for too long BECAUSE I WAS CALLING FOR THAT TO HAPPEN BECAUSE IT WAS THE SMART THING TO DO. Smart and Glen Sather - an oxymoron waiting to happen. SATHER SUCKS!
RF4L
DanyloHalytskyj : I agree. A guy like, well taking teh AVS, Foote, is waht is needed for teh young D. And I also agree on Prospal and OJ, neither should be given long contracts. I say with Prospal, lets say, 2 years....3 mil, thats 1.5 each, maybe a bit above that, like 1.5 than 1.75, but no more than that. And with OJ, he makes what now, 5.something, I say a 1 or 2 years deal for 3.5 each year. That gives some time for players to develope into the top line roles, and there are not really any UFAs that would be worth a shot this year anyway, and with short, not to high dollar amount contracts, they can be moved easily if needed.
Wildcard
Vic : I tihnk Porspal DOES make the kids better. He shows up and gives 110% almost every shift, in fact, I cant think of a time he has taken a shift off, he might not always get points, but he works hard. With a vet, thats the most important thing. I even see things about how hard Redden works in pratice, that shows young players that you cant just relax and make it in the NHL...its very important. I would rather have a guy like Prospal or Drury, than a high scoreing lazy guy like Yashin.
Wildcard
It wont work with Prospal and OJ, but dont be suprised to see some of the "extra" young players get moved going into and at the draf. Giradi could still fetch a 2nd rounder at the draft, and maybe could be part of a deal to move up to a top 5 pick. He is only an RFA...same goes for Dubi, and Gilroy, and others like Sauer, and Sangs in Hartford. You dont need to move guys who are under contract at the deadline for picks...teams picking up players at the deadline are mostly looking for help now, and will think less about the future, at the draft those same teams will be thinking more about the future, near and far, so a team that is short on young D would easily give up a 2nd rounder for Giradri instead of picking a kid who might not become even what Giradi is today. Also, we dont know what Sather was working on, he may have tried to get some of those players moved, like Muller, but seeing what the Avs gave up it wouldnt shock me if they asked for Dubi, Sanguinetti and a pick, and IMHO thats too much....hell the Avs gave up one fo their top scorers for a guy who is on pace to have half the points that Wolski has NOW.
Wildcard
Ola - you don't need to have all the big names and over priced vets to be a good team. i think Phoenix is the best example of that. All you need is a good goalie and to play like a team. We got the first part covered. Colorodo is another example of a good young team. Hell, they're so good they could afford to move a Wolski at the deadline. We may have some good players but a good team we are not. I think Drury can get them to learn work ethic in the next two years even if they are out of the playoffs. What we do need is a saavy vet d-man to play mentor to our young d and I don't mean Redden or Rozy. We had the guy in Mara who absolutely loved to be here and looked like a fine mentor for Staal and company. Unfortunately, he's been on Torts' shit list for years so he was shown the door. Don't get me wrong i like Prospal and have no problem with Joker but they are only here to get us into the playoffs for revenue. If either is resigned to a major long term contract it will be the same circle of mediocrity all over. And don't get me wrong i like making the playoffs and think they should be a goal every year but there are much smarter ways to retool then currently being employed.
DanyloHalytskyj
OLA: Sorry, I don't buy that about PROSPAL or OJ. NEITHER player is in the class of players that make other players (young kids) or their organization better. RHET: You have absolutely no idea what MESSIER would do or wouldn't do. That is the problem. He has no track record at all, let alone a track record of success as a GM.
Vic
DANYLO...I would've preferred to have been sellers at the deadline too, but SATHER is "trying" to make the playoffs... There is no way they trade him... the one guy I thought they could've traded was GIRARDI... I thought we could've easily gotten a 2nd rounder for him and replaced him in the lineup without too much trouble... VIC... though I don't think he's ready, the one thing I'd like about MESSIER being a GM is that we wouldn't be overpaying FA's to come here to play, he wouldn't have the SATHER "gotta over pay them for them to come here" mentality that he brought with him from EDMONTON... MESSIER would consider it any players privilige to play here and that would be refreshing... GENE... Keenan will never be back here as coach, he has done nothing since 93/94 and burnt his bridges everywhere... though Sather bringing in MacT wouldn't be a shocker to me... STEVIE... the minor League deal was a deal that you never would've even heard of if it was completed on any of the other 364 days of the year... it's the kind of deal that GM's make all the time that goes under the Radar... I am baffled by the ERIKSSON deal though... Did we owe Phoenix any "Future Considerations" from a previous deal? ...DAVIDSOC... PROSPAL isn't going anywhere... he will make a bit more than he did this year on a 1-year deal... he still get's paid $1.167 Mil a year by the LIGHTNING... Now that he's 35, he wont get more than a 1 year deal... VINNIE loves it here and he's playing well here... I don't see him leaving...
Rhet0ric
Maybe I'm missing something but what would have been wrong with a couple of 2nd round picks for PROSPAL and OJ? That is two additional draft picks that they now won't have. Those picks could have turned into anything. Even a guy with SATHER's draft record can get lucky on a draft pick. What would they have lost sending PROSPAL and OJ away for draft picks? Would that have cost them the Cup? Well, if you have the Rangers winning the Cup in your Crack Induced dreams then maybe. Even with OJ and PROSPAL in the lineup I give this team a 25% chance to make the playoffs. At the end of the year both will be UFAs. I am willing to be that NEITHER player resigns here. Even if they do there was nothing that would have prevented them from resigning here in the offseason if they were traded now. This was just another wasted opportunity for SATHER to do something to help build a future that had anything other then HOPELESS MEDIOCRITY for this organization.....
Vic
Dany- I understand your reasoning. But I don't agree. No matter what, who do you play with Staal? MDZ? Dubinsky? Callahan? Anisimov? Avery? Boyle? Grachev? Stephan? Kreider? YOUNG TALENTED KIDS PLAYING FOR GOOD TEAMS BECOME GOOD PLAYERS. Young talented kids playing for worthless teams in the NHL have a much harder time becoming good players. Hockey is unique in that sense, from what I know about other team sports in the US at least. In other to score pts in the NHL, you need to practise on playing offensive hockey in the NHL. A kid on like a Detroit in their prime, who plays 82 games, with great linesmates gets like to practise on playing offense for like 82 games * 20 minutes of ice time per game * 25% of the time in the attacking zone = spends 410 minutes in the attacking zone practising on playing offensive hockey. In Florida, that amount, might be a lot less. Datsyuk and Zetterberg becomes Datsyuk and Zetterberg of today in Detriot. Mike Richards and Jeff Carter becomes Mike Richards and Jeff Carter of today in Philly. Zach Parise and Travis Zajac becomes Zach Parise and Travis Zajac of today in NJ. And like David Clarkson becomes David Clarkson of today in NJ. There is a reason for that. Philly need one swing at a kid, and they'll instantly hit homerun. Their batting avg is 1.000, with Mike RIchards and Jeff Carter. Heck you can even mentino RJ Umberger, Philly developed him too. Florida swings for 16 years, and they have yet to develop ONE forward like that. It is NOT a coincidence. Good teams develop good players. Thats why I wanna keep Prospal. He makes our team better. Hence, we will develop our kids better. I rather go that route, then deal some of the assets we have developed in a Oduya, Bergfors and Cormier deal for a Kovalchuk, then dumping everything, risk the kids we have, in order to get a lottery ticket to take a star that can make us respectable in the draft.
Ola
"A feisty Donnie Walsh said it's his fault the club is not winning, not Mike D'Antoni's, and said he has no regrets about embarking two years ago on this cap-clearing plan that gutted the roster." Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/donnie_blame_me_SfOnPeA6uQykEkzIUepzdP#ixzz0hDVS3AZh ....nothing is sather's fault, and it's so hard for him that poor guy forced to hide from the press. What a shame and a sham.
stevielegs
When we closed in on 3pm last night I realized there really was a very small chance for something to go down. Even small moves. We have/had a full roster. Gilroy is the odd man out on defense. Up front, the odd man out would probably be Boyle. If Slats could have packaged Sanguinetti/Dubinsky/Gilroy for a "upgrade" up front, or on defense, in terms of like a Weiss/Booth/Hamhuis/Jack Johnson I would have loved it. But those kind of moves are very hard to make.
Ola
What if Gabby doesn't play another game this season because of his lower body injury? Was is then worth hanging on to Prospal because he is the only guy who had chemistry with him?
DanyloHalytskyj
Re the argument about trading OJ and Propsal yesterday. I see the merit but agree that neither would likely fetch much. For sure, expecting a 1st rounder for either is a pipe-dream (IMO). Both would have likely gotten back 2nd rounders and where would that have gotten the Rangers? The positive for me of moving out both is that the team would likely bottom out, thereby giving them a better chance at Taylor Hall. The real vet purge (post 2004) should have occurred 3 years ago - the likes of JJ, Rozey, Shanny, etc would have brought back a bounty of picks and prospects. Now we have endless mediocrity...
RF4L
Could Prospal have fetched us a 1st rounder? Lately we have seen that the going rate for a "player"; without a bad contract, often soon to be UFA/RFA; is a 2nd round pick. May it be a 5th D or a 3rd lineer. Often a team feels that they need to improve their depth. They know they have a chance to get deep into the players, and when they look down the depthchart they see that if they get a injury or two -- they are forced to bring up unexperienced players. To fill that void, you need to give up a 2nd round pick. I think plenty of teams would be willing to give up that for Prospal too -- but more? Just becaues he is better, a lot better, doesn't mean the price gets a lot better. And I would never deal Prospal for a 2nd round pick.
Ola
Colorodo - I for one was not proposing trading either Prospal or Joker for a contract but for high picks. And while I like Drury and agree that he is a quality team guy we are going nowhere the next two years with him, Redden and Rozie eating the amount of cap space that they are, also taking into account that we will lose another 1.4 mil in cap space next year to a person who will not even be playing in Brashear. We need to spend the next two years building for the post Drury/Rozival contracts. The post Redden period apparently is another generation away. I also agree that it is speculation what we could have gotten in return but i am pretty sure the question wasn't even examined by chomper.
DanyloHalytskyj
Sather SUCKS...in case anyone isn't clear!
RF4L
I'm with E on this trade deadline. I'd much rather see us hold on to our young players and why would we want to get rid of the one guy on our roster that has definite chemistry with Gaborik? And speculation on what we could have gotten for him is just that: Speculation. He's also a great leader and his influence on our younger players can't be measured. The problem is everyone wants fantasy hockey type deals where we keep turning over our roster ever 4 months when the team isn't what we want it to be. I like the way the team is playing. Redden is the only guy who I can't stand wearing the blueshirt. People complain about Drury and his contract, but it's not like he's Val Kamensky and he's obviously respected in the locker room and around the league so any complaints about his lack of leadership are again just an outsiders interpretation of something they know nothing about. Rozy has improved his game and at times has been one of our better D-men in the last month. He actually seems to care. I'd trade him in a minute, but he doesn't infuriate me. I love the fact that we have three rookies in the lineup and the majority of our team is under 25. I'd rather have the option to walk away from OJ and Prospal after the season then take on another contract we're stuck with.
ColoradoMark
GENE: A MESSIER/KEENAN tandem would probably be about the worst thing this team could do. They will blow up the roster (and Hartford) again and neither guy has ever shown the long term ability to plan and build a team (like BURKE or LAMARILLO do). It will be 5 to 10 years more of scatter shooting and Attention Deficit Disorder Drafting/UFA signing. I'd like to see MESSIER in a GM capacity of a Juniors team or maybe even just a McDonald's franchise so he can at least prove that he can manage the drive-through window before we turn the keys to the Ranger franchise over to him.....
Vic
"Blueshirts acquired veteran defenseman Anders Eriksson from Phoenix for Miika Wiikman and a No. 7. Eriksson, who had a brief 2006 training camp tryout with the Rangers, was assigned to the AHL Wolf Pack." Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/rangers/slats_stays_the_course_QWep3GMJblQyzyEUkY36LL#ixzz0hDGiBtJ5 ....................and the genius gets away with this, the teflon gm. that guy is worth 2 players? .....gmafb......the koolaide is now extra-strength......and the other deal is a joke too........the genius made his big deals before the Olympics. But to have the nerve to make those 2 'deadline deals' is an insult. .......and a disgrace to the crest coach needle nose worries about.
stevielegs
POTTER has to realize, by now, that he is never going to get a chance to play in this organization. It is a shame because every time this kid has been promoted he has played well. That goes for the last few years, as well as this year. The same can be said for HEIKENIN and SAUER. They will never be on this team's radar. SANGUINETTI still has a chance but I think he will get dealt while he still has some value.
Vic
E. I have to agree with your assessment. Sather did not give up prospects or picks for a rental and that was very good. The only player moved that would have been of value for us was Wolski and we could not afford what he would command. The team is tougher now with the moves that were made pre-olimpics and I believe create a better enviornment for development. We will pick in the bottem third of this draft class and that should produce another good player. I still maintain there is a plan for Sather to depart or relinquish the GM role after the season and I wouldn't be surprised if Mess is installed and that Keenen will follow shortly as coach. In any event doing nothing was the best tactic in my opinion and major changes will come after the season is over.
gene_carr
And Clarke MacArther fetched a 3rd and a 4th and he's achieved very little compared to Prospal. The deadline is where teams give up more to fill needs. I'm sure a team like Pitt who was desperate for a winger would have given us a a very high pick for Prospal as would have anyone else for that matter considering his cap hit is less than Brashear's.
DanyloHalytskyj
E - are you talking about the Eric Belanger who averages 36 pts a season? Prospal on an off year when he isn't trying averages over 50 and on a good year gets you 80. So if Belanger is worth a 2nd then Prospal is worth at least that especially in a year when he is putting up good numbers and has played consistently well.
DanyloHalytskyj
Bob- (About Philly's goaltending issues) There is justice in the world! ;) Seriously they have not had that starter in 25 years. Not since Pelle Lindberg died. Ron Hextall? Sure he won a Conn Smythe and was decent. Maybe he counts. Maybe not. He was never really up there with the best. Anyway, I thought it was hilarous when Pierre McQuire at TSN was asked last night if he thought if Philly should do anything about their goaltending situation -- and said "no", unless they can get like Roloston, lets give Leighton a chance. If Philly once and for all took care of their goaltending situation, they would win a few cups over a 10 year period. And we in NY would have been humiliated even more. I can not believe that they don't pay more attention to it. Its like with Johan Gustavsson this summer. He could be had for free. He isn't ready to be a starter in the NHL, but he definitely could become a top 5 guy in 5 years. Philly were interested in him, but didn't get something done. I can't understand it. Burke now have JSG and Monster in Toronto. Philly have not had a tandem in net that strong in 17 or 25 years, depending on how you look at JSG vs Hextall. And they basically could have had that tandem without giving up much at all. Thank god.
Ola
Does anyone else feel like this trading deadline sucked? No big names got moved. And of course glennie doing nothing for the rangers.
NV94
Well, we are a mediocre team again, and are minus-1 draft picks on the day when we should have bulked up on picks by trading Girardi, Prospal and Jokinen at least. But there is good news.........The Flyers are going with Michael Leighton in goal for the playoffs. Once again.....they refuse to invest in a decent goalie. LOL.
Bob
DanyloHalytskyj : If Prospal was going to fetch a 1, then Sather would have packed him personally. Eric Belanger fetched a 2 pick. Clarke MacArthur was fetching a 4 pick. There was NO way Prospal was going to get you anything in that league healthy. With a wonky knee, he is worth far more to us than it would be to anyone else. RE: if someone were willing to give up a 1 and a top prospect for Jokinen that would be spectacular. 7 games ago all that Calgary could get for him was the useless Higgins, and a Kotalik who was atrocious.
E
E - I think calling my post schizo is a little harsh. I never said to trade Prospal for a play with a longer contract. I would have traded Prospal for a second rounder and a prospect or even just the pick for that matter. Same for Jokinen. The fact of the matter is that we will wallow in mediocrity with the team that you connect to so well, get a mid level first rounder and continue to be equally mediocre for years to come. I agree that Gaborik has been amazing this year, but to insinuate that we have him at a good number is exaggerating. He has a cap hit of 7.5 million for the next four years and I am under no illusions that he will have more injury free seasons like this year. History tells us otherwise. Who are all these "oodles of young guys" with so much upside. I love Callhan and Dubinsky and I think they are solid players and we have some nice players in our system, but this team has no direction and no vision. Whether you like him or not, when Brian Burke goes to a team as a GM you know his GM philosophy. You know what you get with him. What do we get with Glen Sather? We have a GM who routinely gets us into the playoffs as a low seed so that the team owner can continually raise ticket prices. There is no sense of "building" a team... only "throwing one together." All I was saying in my post was that if it is clear that we are not heading to the Stanley Cup Finals (and sadly it is) then why not make moves for the future?? We remain an average team as teams around us improve and continue to improve with good personnel decisions.
evets1980
Danylo: I wanted to see Sather trade Prospal for a draft pick or young asset. Was hoping we could get enough young assets or draft picks to take a shot at moving up in the draft for a shot at a player like Seguin. Instead we will squeak into the playoffs, get swept, draft late in the first round, and probably overpay free agents in the off-season.
davidsoc30
Tank You Sather , don't mess up the pick ....................
stevielegs
E - personally, I don't mind resigning Prospal if the price is very reasonable but with the season he has had he could have easily fetched a second if not a first round pick. I have also stated that I would have no problem resigning Jokinen either at around 4 mil per but preferably 3.5. The flip side once again though is if someone was willing to give up say a first and a decent prospect for Joker at the deadline I take that in a heartbeat too.
DanyloHalytskyj
DanyloHalytskyj: I have the same fear with Sather resigning Prospal. I can just see Sather signing him to another ridicious contract, typical Ranger/Sather philosophy.
davidsoc30
evets1980: I think that your post is a little schizo. You can't convict Sather for not trying to improve the team at the deadline and not selling off assets. You want to move Jokinen? A guy who came in on a trade for a bunch of nothing a week ago? And he has 5 points out of the gate and looks like he has some chemistry here? If not, we traded nothing for him and we can watch him go bye-bye if he is not worth it. Did you read what the deals out there were fetching? You want to train Prospal for some other waste with a longer contract? I think that this has been one of Sather's best deadline's since he came to NY. If he could have moved some of his deadweight (obviously he caused them), he would have. Personally, I would love to sell off veterans just to mix up and change the culture in the offseason. This has been one of the most gratifying seasons for me in years. I find myself identifying more with this team then in many years past. We have a killer sniper in the prime of his career at a good number. We have a top notch goalie. We have oodles of young guys that I see has upside. So many on this wall railed on ad nausea for years about a youth movement. You have it and you still aren't happy. For years bitching, pissing, and moaning about trading assets for some has-been douche who would be a short timer for a team that is on the bubble. This time it wasn't. We kept draft picks, we kept youth. Someone has to be on the team. What was Prospal going to give you? A minor leaguer? A plugger soon to be a UFA? A 2nd rounder in 2012? I would just as soon keep him and wait out the season. He parts company giving a yeoman's service to the team. Big loss there. All while the youth gets better. Sure we have some issues that cannot be filled internally. We lack a bonafide long term solution at the 1 center spot. We need more scoring threats. But damn, the deadline doesn't have to be a blow it up and retool scenario. The contracts I wanted to dump were the big three cap killers. Clearly, we have seen by the absence of movement that is going to be very difficult indeed. But Sather didn't hurt the team anymore then it was yesterday.
E
Rf: That would be, "SatherSlayer", now dont let last nights victory fool you, the crystal ball says somewhere between going 7-12 in the remaining 19 games and 1 & done in the po's......to be continued......
mf
mf: Are you a soothsayer?? If so, how deep will the Rangers go in the POs this spring??
RF4L
March 7th: Breaking news: Thousands of Rabid Fans wearing golf shoes trample NY Rangers GM Glenn Sather to death. story at 11:00 ........... woohoo !
mf
The sad thing is we will lose Prospal over the summer for nothing as is Sather's MO or he will sign him to an insane contract which we will regret for years. Same with Jokinen. Hell we could have probably moved Prospal for a first rounder or a real good prospect and still resigned him in the off season.
DanyloHalytskyj
Ok... I've got to let out these feelings of disgust with Glen Sather. I know most of these sentiments have been made before on the wall, but I just can't contain myself. Now... I cannot fathom that Sather--being someone who has been a part of this league for decades--can see the moves that teams like Pittsburgh and Washington, and to a lesser degree Buffalo made today to shore up their team for the playoff stretch and playoffs, in addition to the acquisition of Kovalchuk by the Devils and still believe that this team could possibly win anything more than just getting into the playoffs. Clearly Sather was not willing to surrender younger players of the team like Cally and Dubi (thankfully) to make a big splash trade to somehow improve the team, therefore, he has to recognize that this team is not going to win and I simply cannot believe that he didn't recognize it. He could have moved Prospal for a prospect and a pick. He possibly could have moved Jokinen after his Olympic performance for a pick, prospect or both. He could have moved Girardi and gotten a nice return. I just don't understand this at all. Where are we now???? Damnit!!!!! It's so difficult being a fan of this team!!!!
evets1980
Dan exactly, if he called you what would you think?
stevielegs
stevie - apparently Gainey did when he took Blomez. I guess he realized what a dumb shit he was for doing so and resigned. Something Sather would obviously never do here.
DanyloHalytskyj
from carp..."...With Del Zotto planning to return tomorrow, Corey Potter was assigned to Hartford this afternoon."
stevielegs
an obvious sather maloney baloney back scratch er at dopey jimmyboy's expense. Guess he thinks he can help them since he's so magnanimous. He's a vindictive pos who pays people to like him. But he did send his team east to win in 1994. Thank You and RETIRE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!............freakin Deadden is still here.....absurd...................the other gms stood him up like a cheap suit. Who trusts this guy besides his dumb boss? ...............
stevielegs
I think Potter was sent down already. He made no mistakes last night, earning his ticket back to Hartford.
Zebop
RF4L - I've got to disagree...Eriksson is a brick wall on defense. He's possibly the best acquisition in recent memory. He's like Bobby Orr, only better. Sure HOF material. In fact, I once personally witnessed Eriksson rescue 30 orphans from a burning building, shortly before scoring a Gordie Howe Hattrick to win the Stanley Cup and League MVP honors. He was on the gold medal Olympic team this year because of his god-like qualities. He recently was appointed prime minister of the world and of being awesome. THE CUP IS OURS!!!!...but seriously...I'm wondering if this is another Hartford move. I can't imagine this guy is going to be in NY. Not with the way Potter has played.
tdchi
Just why did Sather give up a 7th for this guy anywas?? Did he feel the need to get his putrid name on the list of GMs who made moves today? Gawd, what an absolutely horrible general manager he is. Erikkson! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL...*SIGH*
RF4L
LOL...Rangers get Erikkson? LOL...I realize a 7th rounder usually amounts to nothing, but in this case that what it is. For those who don't know this guy, he's Huber, Purseboy, Ulanob, Krapa all rolled into 1. A big, non-physical, mistake-prone defenseman who through his entire career has been a HUGE case of the whole not even coming close to the sum of the parts. Another excellent acquisition by the master of mediocrity. LOLOLOL!
RF4L
Although the deadline as a whole was a snoozer, one team really beefed up is the Yotes. Stempniak, Wolski, Morris...and on a lesser note, Picard and Nokelainen(remember that he was once on a line with Korpikoski in juniors)...not tough enough to beat San Jose(which didn't man ANY moves BTW...)and probably not enough to best Chicago...but still good moves...SHITSburgh also made some good moves, I'll sheepishly admit. Ponikarovsky will look REAL good on a line with Malkin or Crosby...and Leopold will be a good blueline addition.
tdchi
Bob - because it will be less work for Sather on Draft Day! And you didn't think he was a Genius...
NYStranger
Mess11 - at first I thought you wrote, 'on stained bed sheets...' LOL
NYStranger
Is Sather in a coma? I'm happy he didn't trade away Dubi or Cally but seriously this was it? Huh. And how come 90% of Sather's deals involve sending Wolf Pack fodder to Pheonix? Maloney must really love his old picks and nobody else wants to play with The Genius.
NYStranger
maybe Potter stays up or Heinken comes up....
stevielegs
I saw Ericksson play in Glens Falls about 40 years ago. ... Was the 7th rounder what put it over the top for Maloney? "Can't do it, Glennie, until you throw in that pick!"
Zebop
Ander Eriksson? What, we couldn't get Petr Popovic to come out of retirement?Justwhat we need..another mamby pamby D-man who is scared of his own shadow in the crease...I wouldn;t have traded a used Kevin Steven's Colostomy bag for him...I know , we gave up nothing and he will rarely play, but egads....Hope none of the other defensive schmoes get hurt
Hospo
tdchi- he was. sather really should go. doing his job from the nursing home on strained beets day in the lunchroom.
Messier11
I guess our Christmas came when we got rid of Kotalik.....oh well.....Meanwhile, I recently relocated out of NY and subjected to Time Warner Cable and center ice.....I watched my first non-MSG Rangers game last night.....And it was not only in Standard def. feed, but the Senators broadcast too.....Lets put it this way....the camera man musta been on dope, and the announcers , especially the color guy, were freakin horrible....I rather listen to Michelleti as i sit in a dentist chair waiting on line at the DMV than be subjected to these hacks........
TradeStar28
BTW...Wasn't Erickson IN THE RANGERS' CAMP a few years back? And back then, didn't they decide he wasn't worth it?!? Not that WIICKMAN had any future here...but really...what a waste of time...and a 7th round pick...not that they ever pan out for us...cough...MARCHANT...cough...LUNDQVIST...
tdchi
Wiikman AND a 7th for 35 YO Anders Ericsson to play in Hartford? Why exactly do we keep throwing away picks?
Bob
zip...."...NYR acquire D Anders Eriksson, 35, ex-Wing, from Phoenix for goaltender Miika Wiikman and a seventh in 2011. Eriksson, 35 4 minutes ago via web ......and sent to Hartford......"
stevielegs
oh jesus. anders eriksson from Detroit. We give Detroit Wiikman and a 7th!!!!!
Messier11
waiting on zipay. he said it was additional to the one we struck with detroit.
Messier11
Hospo - I'm kind of shocked that Anaheim did that deal...Visnovsky looks like he's nearing the end...Whitney is just beginning. Too bad we couldn't have convinced them to take Redden and 2nd for Whit....so what was the minor Ranger deal?
tdchi
must be stuttering ;-)
stevielegs
whatever he does or doesn't do.....FIRE OR RETIRE SATHER MARCH 7TH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!,,,,,,the teflon gm...................
stevielegs
whatever he does or doesn't do.....FIRE OR RETIRE SATHER MARCH 7TH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!,,,,,,the teflon gm...................
stevielegs
Yelle to Avalanche and STAIOS to Flames.....OK, where's that minor deal for a 7th D-man?
Hospo
Zipay saying minor deal by Rangers coming
Messier11
Gotta agree with Hospo, thank goodnes no more dead-weight was added and no kids got the boot!
pa.rangersfan
Probably the biggest trade, but with no impact on the Rangers.....Ryan WHITNEY (ANA) for VISNOVSKY (EDM)
Hospo
ok they fixed it now...the flames
Wildcard
LOL...TSN has the preds getting boyd for a 4th rounder from the preds LOL
Wildcard
Vancouver get Andrew Alberts from Carolina for a third rd draft pick. STEAL. Alberts has more hits by a defenseman than all but three others in the league, and hes 28. BTW, for all those of you who say Girardi's soft, he has more hits by a defenseman than all but 13.
Messier11
Sather did his dealing before the Olympic break - getting OJ and Prust. The team is still in a struggle to make the POs and could easily finish 7th overall in the east or 13 and perhaps even 14th. If the former happens, they won't go far. At least Sather didn't make a youth for vet deal and/or give up draft picks. There isn't enough depth or talent in the organization to do that.
RF4L
Well, my hope was that SATHER would deal these rentals and other vets for picks and prospects. If that wasn't going to happen then my next best thing was to just do nothing. If we aren't going to be sellers (like we should be) then at least we SHOULD NOT BE BUYERS!
Vic
Thank God for no Souray...OTOH, stuck with having to watch some of the sme old shit, especially on defense..
Hospo
March 7th: Breaking news: Rabid Fans trample NY Rangers GM Glenn Sather to death. story at 11:00 ........... woohoo !
mf
Souray out for the rest of the season with a post-surgical infection. May have put a damper on Ranger activity.
VtRanger
I'm not going to shed any tears over it...bummer we couldn't be short Redden, but oh well...
tdchi
What you see is what we have for this year. The league GM's told Slats where to go with his overpriced junk. Let's hope we finish as low as possible.
Bob
Brooks confirms no NHL deals for NYR. Guess the Torres deal negated any potential swap between Edm/NYR.
puckyou
Boo...Tim Thomas still a goddamn Bruin..I was hoping he'd get buried somewhere...like the ECHL or something...
tdchi
Jackets' Modin a king for future consids...
tdchi
mounse...what teh F*&K is a mounse? LOL Mouse is what Iment
Wildcard
Carolinia trades Joe Corvo to Caps for Brian Pother and Oskar Osala..
tdchi
Even a broken clock is right twice a day ;)
Messposito
Wow...hell hath frozen over...ECKLUND WAS RIGHT!! Stempniak to Phx for draft picks..via TSN's Dreger...
tdchi
OMG!! Eklund got one!!! The blind mounse found the cheese!!! Mark this date down...it may be a once in a life time event!!
Wildcard
Hang tight - it ain't over yet ... if I remember correctly, trades have been announced up to an hour after the deadline in years past ...
Messposito
Big Rangers trade!!! Rangers aquired The Little Beaver Marcel Dionne from the LA Kings...........oh wait, that was 20+ years ago.....wow, time freakin goes fast
TradeStar28
Wild: touche good sir haha this deadline has really been boring...oh well gotta go back to studying for my midterm Modin possibly gone to LA might not have been in on time
sportyplaya1188
sportyplaya1188: Probably means he going to boston LOL
Wildcard
hmm...anticlimactic at this point...The only regret I have is that a guy like LISIN wasn't parlayed into a pick and that MUELLER couldn't be had...though I certainly wouldn't have paid as handsomely as the Avalanche did...
tdchi
Eklund reporting that stempniak is gone to Phoenix....
sportyplaya1188
Caps reaquire JURCINCA?!? WTF...some screwy GMing going on here...What's next...Sather reaquires Prucha and Dawes?!?...Lee Stempniak...hmm...sounds like more third-line fodder...AND a former teamate of Hugh JESSIMAN at Dartmouth...
tdchi
Like Philly wiothout goalies, the Caps don't get it...only re-aquiring JURCINA to bolster their defense.
Hospo
wow this is pretty sad when you have people wasting their times talking about career AHL players...
jkropp
oh here comes the big one, all the twittering twits say Lee Stempniak is getting dealt...:)
Hospo
Sporty - its and AHL trade with little, inf any impact on the parent club. OWENS was a UFA signing several years back and has an imperceptibly slight chance of making the NHL as a depth/role player sometime in his career...Newbury has already been doing that with the Wings and formerly the Leafs...I'd be willing to bet he doesn't ever throw on a Ranger jersey.
tdchi
jkropp : I bet not, Sather decided two weeks or more ago what he was going to do....he probably has been working the phone the entire olympics about being a buyer...so I doubt he could change gears that fast...or any GM for that matter...it takes time for ground work to be laid for a trade in most cases I tihnk.
Wildcard
so Sather just made a trade for an AHL dud in a wheel chair...this guy needs to get the hell out of the office
sportyplaya1188
JK - Don't think Sather was ever going to be a seller..The Jokinen trade cemented that...I thought he actually would be more of a buyer given the recent play of the team....But , really, if you don't upgrade with a physical D-man and another forward, you might as well sell.....
Hospo
sportyplaya1188: Newbury is 28, and an AHL lifer type....probably just a vet for the pack who is young...dont know though...
Wildcard
DZ not DV...sorry
jkropp
td: See if you can nab a 3rd rounder for the cone and offer it to Sather for a 1st!
RF4L
You have to wonder if today would be different if the Rangers lost that game yesterday and with GABBY and DV out. Maybe SLATS would be a Seller???? Just a thought...
jkropp
Who the hell are the kids in the deal that SLATS made....first off i have no clue who Newbury is.....why was this deal made....change of scenery or something...and the kid Owens was supposed to be our reincarnation of Betts.....either way that trade was a waste of server space on any hockey site....someone please explain to me why this trade was made I would have much rather seen the Rangers trade a box of stick tape to the Red Wings for some new water bottles or a pile of towels
sportyplaya1188
Sather may be being smart...if teams are asking for 1st and 2nd rounders or players like Staal, than he shouldnt do a thing...
Wildcard
paetsch & 2nd rounder to CLB
puckyou
td.. just confirmed on TSN.
pa.rangersfan
And I have a feeling it's better that Chomp STAY SLEEPING!!! I shutter to think what he's up to with Souray and Demitra on the board...
tdchi
Puck - where you seeing that?
tdchi
Bout time for more trade announcments
Wildcard
Somebody call Palm Springs and wake up cigar chomper
puckyou
Raffi Torres to Sabres.dang
puckyou
RF4L - I got a traffic cone that would stop more pucks than TOSKALA ;)
tdchi
Ditto, End...er...PA...I'm not sure how the hell that happened, except for that GMs must have too many deals in the air to make something happen...unless Sather has a deal with a team(s) that were going to claim him...Shit, he's a 23-year-old kid who is at least as valuable(probably more so) than some of the names that have been dealt(Stastny for instance)...The DUCKS have now traded THREE goaltenders in three weeks. That has got to be some sort of record.
tdchi
Hospo: So both can immediately be farmed out to free up their cap space if something goes down in the next 45 minutes....
RF4L
RF4L - getting the feelingthat the Sellers are/were trying to commit robbery on all the deal.s and most times the "buyers" are just saying screw you...Maybe a flurry right at the deadline when it looks like they won't get their price?
Hospo
td: Flames have no back-up goalie and they are like the Rangers and Lundqvist: Kipper plays too many games. Toskola is a pending UFA so it doesn't cost the Flames much. Toskola will probably play 3 to 4 games then not see the ice once the POs start.
RF4L
Wow, what a shock that nobody picked Lisin...or Voros...Hopefully neither will be here next year
Hospo
March 7th: Breaking news: Rapid Fans trample NY Rangers GM Glenn Sather to death. story at 11:00 ........... woohoo !
mf
TOSKALA to the flames?!? WTF?
tdchi
Honestly, glad to see Lisin is still in the system. The Club should not give up on this kid.
pa.rangersfan
So far this deadline has been zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
RF4L
C'mon Glen..... dump some $$$$
WolfZR2
Well, we still have Voros and Lisin to kick around. Carp says both cleared.
VtRanger
The Caps have got to be dealing forwards for a D-man before the end of the day....Can we trade them Girardi (Redden/Roszy are not going anywhere) for somebody like Fehh, Fleischman? I wish
Hospo
Man...lots of decent picks and serviceable players going back for shit...Belanger for a second rounder? Halpern for a third rounder and Purcell? Seidenburg for a second rounder and Bitz?!? Still waiting on what Schnieder fetched...On other news(or lack thereof)...whatever became of LISIN?!? Was he claimed? Newsday has something on it, but I'm not a subscriber...
tdchi
JKROPP... not unless they take REDDEN or ROZI off our hands...
Rhet0ric
So, do we want KABERLE? What are some thoughts???
jkropp
Ca;ps ramping up by aquiring Eric Belanger...But they are fools if they don't pick up D...
Hospo
BELANGER to Caps for a 2nd Rounder
Rhet0ric
TDCHI - I agree with that outlook also..The POs are a mustfor this team...Can't see Sather jeopardizing that by dealing Olli and Prospal..
Hospo
TD... Despite all the rumors... I don't think any big contracts will get moved before the summer...
Rhet0ric
VIC - Soory, on m ost nights it looks like DZ has never been taught how to play positional defense..He looks that bad to me...But yopu have a point in comparisons with screwup of Redden..Roszival has played pretty well lately.
Hospo
mf - I'll sign over my fortune if Oli or Prospal are traded. They're hear for the haul...and the more I see defensemen move, the more I think Rozsival will be here too.
tdchi
HOSPO, I agree on MDZ and GILROY with the exception that I don't believe MDZ has been as bad defensively as you make him out to be. He has been no worse the hoRRor twins on most nights and miles better offensively. As for OWENS, I've seen him play for the Pack a few times. He is a grinder and I never got the impression that he was going to be an NHL player.
Vic
Per TSN... KABERLE has an agreement with Brian Burke, Burke will tell him what deals he has on the table and KABERLE will decide if he wants to go to that team...
Rhet0ric
M. SCHNEIDER acquired by COYOTES... KABERLE said he would waive his trade clause in the right deal...
Rhet0ric
TAMPA BAY LIGHTNING SEND HALPERN to LA
Rhet0ric
Trade them all ! Joki, Prospal, Rozi, get some 1st rounders... If Oli & Prospal want to be Rangers next year, they can resign & come to terms over the summer....This upcoming draft does not sound as deep as last years...If it was, I would have read about it here courtesy of you hockey guru's. I have not read this...That means, we need a top pick if we're going to salvage anything from this season, and it also means the scouts better do a real good job finding talent in this crop.....
mf
Holy crap..I was right...half past and the trade is announced.
Wildcard
tdchi to sather: Trade vets, or get out of the fray. DON'T TRADE THE YOUTH!!!(under penalty of rigorous finger shaking and a potential voodoo hex).
tdchi
bob: "we have no prospects to trade for a center, not much in the system and a bunch of overpaid decaying vets" really...with one of the youngest AHL teams, and a ton of young kids who have been doing well at their level. I bet Sather could trade fro a number 1 center right now, it would jsut cost 5 or 6 kids...so not worth it...
Wildcard
WILD-- right you are. Nice to have a pro lem like the Av's have. Meanwhile, we have no prospects to trade for a center, not much in the system and a bunch of overpaid decaying vets. I hope Sather does not do further damage.
Bob
calm before the storm...
tdchi
Next announcment in a few min I bet....
Wildcard
(R5) LOL
Wildcard
You guys keep pushing Sather to make deals and he will probably accomodate you. There has not been a trade deadline of Sather's that he has not liked BTW; I saw people tauting Andy Sutton moving to Ottowa. Wrong Move IMO as evident by that 28th ranked PP. They should have spent that 2nd rnder on Seidenberg or former Ott Corvo to improve that PP. No PP no playoff success.
cnparda
There is an unsubstantiated rumor going around the MOREAU has been dealt... possibly to ANAHEIM... I have no details... Now I feel like ECKLUND... It's an (R5)
Rhet0ric
Anyone else notice, all the trades have been announced around or after teh bottom half of the hour....I mean, I bet we dont see much till after 1:30 eastern now...
Wildcard
RF4L/ZEBOP...Thank you... didn't really want to know, but thanks :)....TSN said they would never have announced this type of deal if it hadn't been Trade Deadline day...
Rhet0ric
Newbury is AHL fodder. He does have over 130 pims for the season though so he must be the responsible type.
pa.rangersfan
Owens played a lot in Hartford. African-American kid; played at least one preseason game here this year; good wheels; a tough kid; will defend himself and others; hasn't shown much of a scoring touch in minors.
Zebop
Owens is/was an UFA junior signed by Sather who, at best, is an NHL checking 3rd liner, but likely is an AHL lifer. I think he's like 21, so arguably he still has time to develop (and in Detriot where they nuture their young properly, who knows), whereas Newbury is at best, a fringe NHLer. Given Hartford's horrible record over the past several weeks, I suspect this is vet for the Pack deal.
RF4L
tdchi - I'm with you once Dubi is traded & put in the proper position to succeed, the Rangers will be looking for a power forward again but we had him Dubi. Let me see when did this great organization do this before oh yeah we drafted & traded Mark Savard even though he came up for 2 games & if my old man's memory eludes me didn't he have like 3 pts. in 2 games then we traded him. let me see Rick Middleton to the Bruins another great trade. I know I might burn in hell but trade Dubi & I think I become an Islander fan. They will win another cup before us anyway.
desi04
Owens is listed as one of the "other notibles" on hockeys future....even they dont talk him up....this Newbury guy is built like Hollweg, is 28 and has like 48 NHL games...why did they get him??
Wildcard
Holy crap...what a move by Sather. This is the PO push deal we were all waiting eagerly for!!!
RF4L
Rhetoric - I consider myself a pretty big die-hard Ranger fan and I have NO idea who Owens is either.
Tikkanen
that should've been can't spell DEMITRA... NM
Rhet0ric
Both 1 and 2 are hard to do, and I'm thining we keep Olli and Prospal for the PO run, so it might ne noe of them..Still hoping for a physical D-man and a decent winger or play making center....I really can see Demitra...
Hospo
TIKK... Who is Jordan Owens? HOSPO... his name has been linked to us in rumors... that was right around the time the TSN guys said, you can spell DEMITRA without IR...
Rhet0ric
jkropp.., I am the artist formerly known as "endzone1." I just changed my screen name for national security reasons. LOL!!! I live in the wonderful city of Bethlehem, not too far from you. Right in the heart of Cheesesteak Flyer Country!
pa.rangersfan
Bob: the Avs also have Ryan O'Reilly in the middle, They area stacked there...and I cant see any of the "big 3" centers playing 3rd/4th line roles...something is going to have to give there over the next year or two.
Wildcard
Sather cannot just sit and do nothing today.....He has 3 choices - 1) He swings for the fences on a blockbuster deal 2) He tries to get rid of some of the toxic contracts (redden or blowzival) . 3) He gets rid of Jokkinen and/or Prospal for 1st round picks.
TradeStar28
WOOHOO we got CHRIS NEWBURY from DETROIT for JORDAN OWENS... the missing piece!
Rhet0ric
Who or what is a Kris Newbury?
Tikkanen
So do we end up with Gabby's country man by dealing a D-man and/or some youth for DEMITRA???
Hospo
Maloney got a nice return for Mueller. Wolski was on the outs with the coach. Colorado no has Stastny, Duschene and Mueller down the middle. All young and relatively inexpensive. With the emergence of Chris Stewart, Wolski was expndable. Nice to have young prospects with potential to trade instead of overpaid, decaying veterans. We'll end up ith Demitra and Souray.........just watch.
Bob
good move by the Caps only giving up a 7th rounder for Walker..If healthy, his game will be of help in the POs.....SUrprised Wolski was able to fetch Mueller plus Porter (former Hobey winner, right?)
Hospo
SLATS not doing anything today, would not be such a bad thing...
jkropp
Meuller & another to COL for Wolski
PatrickDiv
PA Ranger Fan where are you in PA? I'm in West Chester
jkropp
And Sather sits by twiddling his thumbs...working on a draft pick for youth deal!!
RF4L
LOL...Sorry, I thought everone knew who Pierre-Cedric LABRIE was:)
Rhet0ric
Mueller and Wolski now off the board.
pa.rangersfan
PER TSN... Mueller and Porter for WOLSKI... done deal...
Rhet0ric
Rhet - holey shit...you've got to specify WHICH Stastny...I almost threw my computer across the room when I read that...YAN Stastny...
tdchi
STASTNY to CANUCKS for Pierre-Cedric LABRIE
Rhet0ric
MUELLER for WOLSKI trade talk heating up
Rhet0ric
Rhet0ric - I used to be a big fan of HORTON'S, but the more I hear about him the more I hear he's a head-case and not worth the time...so I guess a lot would depend on what the deal was. Certainly, I wouldn't grouse about Dubi for Horton straight up!
tdchi
Scott Walker to the Caps..decent grit pickup, but they need a D-man BADDDD
Hospo
TDCHI - Pogge to the CANES for A. Ward....I don't see the Bruins dealing Thomas even if Rask might have supplanted him...I still think the Bruins go back to Thomas for the stretch drive.We'll see..
Hospo
VT/TDCH -Oops, my bad, I knew it couldn't last! I agree with TD's sentiments about not wanting to trade DUBI but there are more then a few youngish 1st-2nd liners (No matter where they were picked) I would deal him for....Don't think they will be offered though! and why I want Dubi to remain a Ranger
Hospo
The Bruins had 4 2nd rounders prior to that FLA trade...
RF4L
Rhet0ric: First I think Dubi will be a 2nd line wingger with time. However, even with that, I would tarde him for the right player. Horton would be one of those, depending on what else had to go I would do it. I dont think many feel he is untradable, I like him, but I know he could be moved, and in some cases should be, but he shouldnt be moved "just" to dump Redden...I think thats the wrong type of move.
Wildcard
TD... Trading DUBI... you mean there are certain people on this board that will never let us forget it... he is a 3rd line player, you're telling me you wouldn't package him in a deal for HORTON?
Rhet0ric
Remember when the Rangers went after and signed long term expensive deals with DRURY and GOMEZ...that was awesome, minus the awesome.
jkropp
Are the Flyers looking for a goalie?
jkropp
WILD... that's exactly what I said about GIRARDI... I would rather see us bring up a rookie in his place next year... he's better than most of the crap that's been traded on D
Rhet0ric
Pogge to Bruins...Tim Thomas on his way out? You betcha, I say...
tdchi
How much influence do you think MESSIER has this year at the trade deadline... Hopefully he is giving an earfull to SLATS for this team to get tougher...
jkropp
VT: Ive been thinking the same thing....these GMs are nuts IMHO. I say Slats could get a high 2nd rounder for Girardi today, and if so, than go for it. I mean hell...if teams are over paying, let them over pay....LOL...could probably get a 2nd for Voros at the rate the GMs are tossing picks aroud today.
Wildcard
Boggles my mind how teams are throwing away second round picks for mediocre players that they could have signed as UFA's this past summer. Hospo/TD: No GM is going to trade a former top 5 pick on the cusp of making it big for Dubi.
VtRanger
jkropp: Well I am sure Gernander will be thought about, than you have to take a shot in the dark...what other coaches get fired the year beofre or the same year?? its too hard to figure out...IMHO
Wildcard
Here is even a bigger question...who do the Rangers hire as their next coach when Torts wears out his welcome in a year or 3?
jkropp
TDCHI - I know nothing about Bartkowski but I know Botz and Weller..are pretty insignificant...Still, a 2nd for Seidenberg is a good return for the Panthers..
Hospo
From TSN -"Vancouver GM Mike Gillis has been quiet this season. He has made one trade, and that came in the summer when the Canucks received Christian Ehrhoff and Brad Lukowich from San Jose for Daniel Rahimi and Patrick White. With the Canucks a playoff contender at this point, and with some injury issues on the blue line, Gillis might be a GM to watch on trade deadline day." COME'ON SLATS!!! HODGSON OR SCHROEDER!!! KESLER!!!
tdchi
BTW...The Kitties just RAPED the Bruins. Great move by their GM for a load of dogshit from the Gulf Coast peninsula.
tdchi
TDCHI - Unfreakingbelievable! ..I agree with every single word you said in that post! on every issues I I'm sure it will be very temporary though...:)
Hospo
VIC - Gilroy is just trying to find the balance between playing aggrsssive offense that Torts wants and responsible defesne taht is needed...Not easy for a rook, even one as old as he is....He will never be the passer that DZ is but, becasue of his age, has caught on 1000X quicker to the defensice game then DZ....However, by next year, or the year afte, they both should be playing close to complete game for the Rangers with DZ being the more offensive/less defensive of the two.
Hospo
Mark my words: The Rangers will SERIOUSLY regret any deal involving DUBINSKY unless there's a top-line player coming back. And by top line, I mean in a former top-5 pick on the cusp of making it big. Dubi's Achilles heal is his inconsistency. But when he's on, he's on...On Gilbert: Why? I defy ANYONE here to explain to me exactly WHAT he would bring to the Rangers other than a $4 million contract OVER FOUR YEARS...Want a player comparison? Tom POTI II. No F'IN thanks...And COGLIANO? I'd call him Dubinsky Ulta-lite. In consistent...shows signs of being a quality player, but the bus is leaving the station on this guy...I sure as shit wouldn't give Dubi AND a second-rounder for him...maybe just the second-rounder...AS much as I'd love to see Redden in a new zip code, it makes NO SENSE in jeopardize the shaky core that this team has to do it...re: SEIDENBURG...Another bullet dodged...now all we need to do is dodge the SOURAY bullet...IF I'm Sather, I offer the Oil a second rounder and Redden for the guy. Take it or leave it. And frankly, if the contracts were equal, I would be willing to believe the Oil would be pulling one over on the Rangers.
tdchi
RHET: On GILROY. I love the way he started the season but he was probably waaaaay to aggressive. I don't know if the coaching staff, his teammates or others got to him to tell him to play more conservatively. Maybe he just did that on his own because he lost his confidence. Whatever the reason, he has been mostly invisible for most of the year. The last few games he has played he has started to play more aggressively. He is joining the rush and anticipating opportunities to jump into the offensive zone. There was a great example of this last night were a shot was taken and there was a long rebound into the high slot. If he was playing cautious he would have been too far back to jump in and get the puck. Instead, he anticipated the rebound and not only jumped in the get the puck, his anticipation was so good that he was able get a good shot directly off of the rebound. I would like to see more of that. This kid has the offensive ability and can skate really well. He will never be the passer that MDZ is but he doesn't need to be.
Vic
SEIDENBERG to the Bruins... VIC... I was talking about flipping him before the deadline(a la SKOULA)... it's all pure conjecture until we know what SATHER has in the works... maybe we have deals in place where we are moving 2 D-men today and that's why GILBERT is in the deal... PUCKYOU ...any more details on that trade rumor?
Rhet0ric
Boston acquires Seidenberg and Bartowski from Fla for Craig Weller, Byron Bitz and a 2nd round pick
puckyou
Well, no Seidenberg---to the Bruins
Hospo
jkroop/Vic - While I would like DZ to get less time (and even some rests) becasue of his atrocius ES defense...I'm not sure we need a PP QB more then we need a physical D-man that can play in the slot and crease....If SOURAY was the only one brought in. his pitiful ES defense would counteract his help on the PP...and not sure we really need the soft mix that Gilbert brings in...
Hospo
RHET: Why would be spend DUBI and a pick to acquire a guy we don't need so that we can flip him for a pick sometime down the road? I want to get rid of REDDEN's contract as much as the next guy but I'm not in favor of making additional stupid moves to try to get the bad contracts from past stupid moves off of the books. The cycle of stupidity needs to end even if it means REDDEN has to play here for the duration of his horrible contract.
Vic
VIC.. I really feel that GILROY has gotten the shaft this year... for most of the year he's had to drag REDDEN's lazy ass up and down the ice... and he's still a Plus 3... the kid should get a medal :)
Rhet0ric
HOSPO... We are fans, of course we think let's just bury $23 MIL in the minors... but the reality may be that DOLAN want to spend the extra $6 MIL over the max every year ... I do think it's too much to give up both, maybe that's the holdup on a deal... SOURAY... he has a smaller contract and IMO has much more trade value than REDDEN... he currently has a NMC, but it expires this July 1st... I'd like to see us trade him in the Summer(if we got him that is)... GILBERT... I don't like him either, but he is a player we could flip for a pick...
Rhet0ric
JK: I am fine with MDZ's learning curve and growing pains. There are enough other guys who could play the point. I'd like to see GILROY and STAAL get more minutes.
Vic
Last time I looked we haven't had a PP QB since Leetch... It would be nice to have one before MDZ learns how to play it...
jkropp
VIIC - Bang on...RHET - I understand about getting rid of REDDEN but throwing in Dubi and a 2nd while also taking on that piece of shit SOuray to get rid of him is assinine...Just send him to damn Hartford in that case..
Hospo
From my limited viewings, Gilbert is another uber-soft puck moving D-man whos main relative value is on the PP...We have plenty of those type of D-men...No thanks...and esepcially not for Dubi....A big physical D-man, a really good playmaking C, and even another big forward---those are the needs in my eyes
Hospo
GILBERT???? Another soft Dman? No thanks. We already have a D pipeline. Don't bring in more soft unreliable Dmen to clog it up. If we are going to get rid of REDDEN and/or ROSI I don't want any Dmen coming back.
Vic
I like Tom Gilbert a lot...
jkropp
HOSPO... If it goes down and if I had my drothers, I'd keep DUBI... but this deal really would be about getting rid of REDDEN... I imagine there are teams out there that like COGS... maybe we filp him afterwards...
Rhet0ric
I'd pass on that deal. We don't need to get smaller unless we are getting an elite skill player.
Vic
Skoula from TO to Devils. Hearing Tom Gilbert from Oilers to NYR, with Dubi going other way in possibly bigger deal
puckyou
SKOULA to the DEVILS
Rhet0ric
Thanks..and you know me well...So I guess Dubi AND a 2nd for him would piss me off big time..I really hope we keep DUBI...I know he has his flaws, but I liek him and i like watching him play.Him and Cally are really the only two players (non rooks) that it would bother me to trade...
Hospo
Hospo: You probably won't like Cog - he's small and fast. Not physical. Supposed to be an offensive centerman, but to date, hasn't really capitalized on his skillset. Definitely a risk, but that's why he's on the trading block. I'd prefer the Rangers target Sam Gagner, but he's likely not available.
RF4L
Rhet - I guess trading Redden for Sourayy is shit for shit but I got no read on COGLIANO.....How do you folks rate him compared to Dubinsky?
Hospo
RF4L... With all the crappy defensemen out there changing teams for decent picks, you'd at least think we could get a 2nd Rounder for GIRARDI... supposedly, there is a trade offer out there of SOURAY, COGLIANO for REDDEN, DUBI and a 2nd Rounder... maybe Edmonton has thought twice about it...
Rhet0ric
DaMn....SoRrY..:)
Hospo
Also see there is alot of interest in SEIDENBERG..could easily see the angers being an interested party..Hey, throw in HORTON and OK..:)
Hospo
Hospo: Don't be surprised that if Souray comes to NY, it's part of a bigger deal that sees Rozey go the other way.
RF4L
And the good news....aCCORDING TO dREGER, SOURAY has dropped his NTC clause for all American teams...New York here we come...wooHOO!...NOT!
Hospo
Morris for a 4th...
RF4L
Maybe.....maybe not. You never know what type of deal it could be. Besides, PM doesn't excite me much anyway. I'd still like to pick him up for the future if he can be had for a steal though.
Vic
Vic: Phoenix's hole was on D and they just added to their cap with Morris. No way are they about to add a Ranger D, even if it's Girardi at $1,500,000.
RF4L
Well, I've taken the crow out of the freezer....The Rangers may be getting it and have plyed pretty darn well over the past 5 games...With a trend like this, Sather's only move(s) will be to improve the current team for a PO run..Who knows, depending on the cost, there might be some merit to it after the Jokinnen eal....Absolutley love when we hold the other team to 25 shots or less...Some simpler hockey without the risky Del Zotto and without Gabby.....Roszy is playing well lately....
Hospo
RF4L: Not necessarily. Unless he went to Boston in the deal then he could still be going elsewhere.
Vic
Well there goes the Mueller to Rangers - Derek Morris just traded there...
RF4L
jkropp- I understand your thinking, but I don't think we need scoring help in terms of someone who can snipe or create his own chances. We need someone who can set up the players we have. And we need it next year too, and in two years, and in three years. No matter what, Kovalev at his age isn't built for a cup run really, and he don't put us over the top in any way or form. Would just be cosmetic to get him. Besides, I think he is history for us, and NY is history for him.
Ola
JKropp ... TSN has a nice trade tracker, plus other stuff. http://tsn.ca/
Zebop
jk: No way!
RF4L
Because he is his own playmaker, I've never seen anyone handle the puck like he has. Yes, he takes games off and yes he is old but he would be a good rental for this year or next especially if we need scoring help...Plus, I'd love to see him retire in Ranger Blue. I would also like to see the Rangers get younger but we always have a chance with The King.
jkropp
jkropp- Why? ;) I mean, I think NHL GM's are way to obssessed with age. Sometimes its a lot more important to give a certain group of kids a perfect environment to develop in, then to give as many kids as possible a chance to prove their worth. That have been proved time after time. BUT, Kovalev wouldn't help any of the kids we have. He is a sniper, we don't have any playmakers. He is so old that he at the most have like a year left in him. Et c.
Ola
What do you guys think of bring Kovalev back if they can afford him?
jkropp
So how come the Bruins suck this year??
RF4L
What is the best website to see the most up to date trades?
jkropp
Happy Trade Deadline Day...for those who will need their fix and will be away from a TV...http://video.nhl.com/videocenter/console?catid=616&id=61166&navid=DL|NHL|home
DOUBLEN
Didn't see the game, but saw the highlights and nice to see both Dubi and Cally step up. Seems to me, both have had a couple of very good stretches this year and not coincidentally, simultaneously, too. It's no surprise that the team overall played well during both of those stretches. The stretches, however, were both shortlived and highlights, IMO, one significant problem with the Rangers. They need these guys to step up on a regular basis, not for every couple of months for 4 to 5 games at a time. The big question for me is this: Is this very obvious lack of consistency part of their maturity process or is what you see what you get basically going forward? If it's the former, it's high time they started to play more consistently, especially Cally. Of the 2, Cally, IMO, is more skilled offensively. Let's not forget that this guy scored 52 goals for the Guelph Storm in his final junior year (an over ager I believe). It's pretty tough to do that without skill. And we've seen enough very nice goals from him to safely say he does have skill. He scored 20 goals last year - he needs to pot 25 this year and shoot for 30 next year. To do that he needs reversed his trend of scoring for 2 to 3 games in a row and then no goals for 5 and 6. Dubi won't score like that, but with the shot he has, needs to shoot more and pass less (he can't pass worth a crap anyways).
RF4L
TD: I was thinking the same thing watching the game last night. It was really tough to sit there and force my way through 60 minutes of boring hockey after watching the Olympic tournament. I consider it an accomplishment that I didn't fall asleep during the game. As for the game itself I thought the Sens looked awful outside of SPEZZA who looked very good. CALLY played great as did CHRISTENSEN. LISIN looked like he got the message but it is too late. AVERY played a quiet game but still came away with 2 points. I wanted strangle DUBI right before he scored because he came down 1 on 2 and tried to stickhandle through 2 players. He turned the puck over at the blue line and it turned into an odd-man rush the other way. Then, DUBI followed that up by scoring on what was a nice play by all three forwards (DUBI, PRUST and BOYLE) but was really caused by the backchecking Sens who picked up the wrong guys leaving DUBI with 20 feet of open space to move in and shoot. All in all it was a good win considering that GABBY and MDZ were not in the lineup and the win came against a good team on the road in a building they have had a tough time winning games in over the years. I also wanted to comment that POTTER looked damn good yet again. There are at least 2 or 3 Dmen in Hartford that can jump into this lineup and play at least as well as REDDEN and ROSI. That shouldn't be the case but it is. If SATHER can moved REDDEN or ROSI to fee up cap space and bring back prospects and picks I hope he does it today. GILORY also looked very good last night. He no longer has that "deer in the headlights" look out there. He looks more comfortable and relaxed, and it looks like he is allowing his instincts to take over instead of over thinking.
Vic
Ola I agree on Gaborik, and he should not be paid for games missed. Let his country pay him.......Why didn't sather and his coach balance their roster?.......I assume they disagree with your concept........
stevielegs
apology not accepted ....http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/rangers/call_it_star_spangled_insult_zZwxIrItY8qOCmvFaGizRP....put the shoe on the other foot......
stevielegs
E- This is how I would structure 3 ideal forward lines. Malone-Datsyuk-Gaborik, Penner-Connoly-Callahan, Byfaglian-Weiss-Cheechoo. Perfectly dooable within the cap. And many of them aren't even on good contracts. 3 PF's. 3 playmaking centers. 2 snipers/dynamos. 1 2-way player. Try to construct a top 9 with players who have-it-all, and you will end up with big flaws on your roster inorder to get it under the cap.
Ola
E- I think you are right and wrong! ;) First of all, I agree with you that reach isn't necessary more important then strengths. But, if you have both, like a Ryan Malone, Franzen, Penner, Byfaglian or someone like that -- thats very valueble. I've seen a big tendancy lately that indicates the value of having players with both. How often they are able to break a deadlock. AND, you really hit a nerve of mine when you said that Anaheim won because Ottawa couldn't handle their pounding. I couldn't agree less. I do however think Anaheim thought thats what they won. Everyone hyped them for it. BUT, what was the difference between Anaheim that year and Anaheim in later years? IMO, they won because they had it ALL. Andy McDonald were great in that PO. Påhlsson played really really well. Getzlaf was a young and upcoming center. They also had Marchant. In other words, they had 4 centers who could handle the puck, close the gap between their D's, transport the puck up ice and keep the puck within the team. That along with Scott Niedermayer moving the puck extremely well -- gave them the highest score in terms of ability to play a puckpossesion game. NOW HERE IS MY POINT. You can only AFFORD TO HAVE SO MANY "PF'S" ON A TEAM. If anything, thats the lesson Anaheim learned after winning the cup. They basically dumped McDonald. Påhlsson got injured. Neidermayer took a vaccation. And they added more PFs. The results? They basically became a worthless team overnight. With a cap today, you can not have 18 all around players. You need to build a team that have it all instead. But with flawed parts. Of your top 9 forwards, you cannot afford to have many have-it-all. So, on your top 9, I think its pretty ideal to have 3 BIG, STRONG AND SOMEWHAT TALENTED PF'S. Then maybe 1 two way guy. And 5 players who basically are playmakers, snipers, dynamos. Look at the USA in the Olympics. Malone, Ryan, Kessler and Langenbrunner. The rest, most around 5'11-6'0 and most playmakers/snipers/dynamos. I think thats the line you should build after. So, I think it becomes a problem if we collect too many PF's who are built like Callahan, Avery and Proust. Because then, our talent will need to have size, or we won't have any size or we will have to little talent. Do you get what I mean? Why is that better? Because its a lot easier to find talent standing 5'11 then its to find talent standign 6'4.
Ola
Habs' D'Agostini to the Blues for Aaron Palushaj...Ducks' Boynton to Chi-town for future considerations...Emery out for the season...Gotta wonder if the Bruins risk trading them TIM THOMAS...or if the Habs offer PRICE...Penguins continue to drain their farm system...Gotta wonder about that...They really have high hopes for Sid, Staal, Malkin and Fleury, since aside from Tangradi, their farm system is BARE with a capital 'B'...how soon until they're tanking again?...ON TONIGHT...What a let down after the Olympic hockey!! But still, a good win...I reaffirm my statement: I do not want to see Cally, Dubinsky, Staal, MDZ and Hank in any deal...I'll throw Girardi, Gilroy and Anisimov in with those names as well...Strong games by BOYLE and LISIN...unfortunately, I would bet just about anything that LISIN gets claimed...and that the Rangers have some fucking vet in his place tomorrow...I just hope whatever deal Sather makes it's for the the longterm and not just a mortgage. I'm not sure what they're aiming to get with $2 million in cap space...interestingly enough, MUELLER's cap hit is $1.7 million...Sather freed up $1.7 million in space with Voros and Lisin...Mueller is an RFA...count me as one not really intetrested in WOLSKI. Good player, but certainly not what this team needs right now...He's an RFA...he's going to be due probably $3.5 million...he's tall, but not overly physical...has talent, scores goals, but has never turned it up to that high gear...hmm...can you say ZHERDEV II?!? No thanks. I'd rather watch Dubi.
tdchi
OLA: I think that you are right and wrong. All teams look for the 3 s': size, speed, skill. That is always ideal. Big physical teams are tough to play against especially in the playoffs when you cannot overstate the value. I draw a classic case of this when Ottawa played Anaheim two years ago. Ottawa wilted under the physical pounding they were dealt. I think that a good big tough defenseman still matters not because of strength. There is a belief that size equals strength. in many ways some of these smaller defenseman get in underneath the bigger PF's and lever them out of the crease. But the big issue is reach. Bigger players just have that reach to create a bigger radius around them. When I play, I consider myself pretty strong and capable of pushing people around but if the guy can dangle, he can keep the puck to the outside and make it difficult to defend. There isn't much you can do to overcome genetics.
E
It would also be interesting to know what obligations the Slovaks had towards the NYR. I would be very surprised if they were to free to use players who could aggrevate a injury he had. And thats what they did. I also think that was very reckless by them. If we Europans want NHLers in the Olympics in the future, we should accept some things. One is to not burn bridges like this. You use the players you have, but its a no-go to "burn" a player. You can't threat the OG like its G7 of the Stanley Cup Final.
Ola
Gaborik should not have played in the Bronze Game. The NYR should have stopped him if nothing else. A Olympic Semi is one thing. But, in a bronze game you don't risk your future. And you definitely don't do it in the middle of a NHL season. And especially not with a groin injury.
Ola
One thing though is that Colorado are looking to move Wojski in order to avoid any potential longterm cap problems with WW. They are not extremely high on him, and are afraid of what he could get in arbitration. We are kind of in the same situation with Dubinsky. And of the pices I would imagine that we would consider moving for a WW, Dubinsky, Girardi and co stand first in line. But Colorado would never take BD, he have the same problem as WW...
Ola
Wolski is no star, and never will be. But I would still be interested in him. I think we need a few offensive pices with size, and some ability to drive to the net (Not a Antropov in other words). 6'3 is even a tad small in that aspect. But, these days teams are sticking 5'10 D's to their roster on a regular basis. Many teams now have at least a D that size, and more will come. All you need is a D like that, in a 1 on 1 battle with someone 4-5 inches taller infront of the net, and you can get a quality scoring chance. We are seeing it with Franzen in Detroit. Byfagulian in Chicago. Lucic. Malone. Penner. Heck even Voros have had some success here early last season. On "good teams", players with size who gets to spend a lot of time in the attacking zone, can do a lot of damage. In a deadlock, they can still make a big difference. Our PF's on the other hand, they are like 6'0 on avg. Thats not ideal.
Ola
MF.... Per TSN, Phoenix and the Avs are talking about WOLSKI... supposedly with Mueller involved... we need to be all over this... we have the assets to get a deal done...
Rhet0ric
Ponikarovski to Pitt for Martin Skoula and prospect Luca Caputi. Bob Makenzie stated in an article on TSN that Wolski is available as is Brad Boyes from St. Louis. Obviously Cogliano's name is still floating out there. Also according to the article, it seems that Philadelphia is dangling Ryan Parent.
evets1980
Aaron Ward scratched tonight
Messier11
Rhet: re: Wolski: If this is true, we need to acquire this kid, then we can stay away from the Kovalchuck noise, and focus on a center & Dman....Wonder if the Av's still have an interest in Drury? Pass the bong!
mf
shocking
stevielegs
I was watching the OTTAWA broadcast of the Rangers/Sens and they mentioned that WOLSKI is on the block... there is some real ugliness going on between him and the AVS coach I believe... he is a guy I would trade DUBI for... in a HEARTBEAT!
Rhet0ric
Torts just has guys he doesn't like Mara and Zherdev last year. This year Lisin was his major whipping boy. Lisin had a pretty strong game and after he had a decent shift where he got open and got a great shot on net they show him going to the bench and Torts ripping into him.
DanyloHalytskyj
Ottawa looked completely discombobulated out there. They made the Rangers look unstoppable
E
Sorry Rhet.., my bad.
pa.rangersfan
Looks like Ponikarovski to the Pens, deal not finalized yet.
pa.rangersfan
Who are these guys out there ? Love Cally's hustle,
HamiltonHellhound
RF4L... I do agree with you, but the worst part of the whole equation is SATHER sucks at evaluating young talent... a shrewd GM would trade some of these extra pieces for young pieces that we need while our players value are at their peak... SATHER hasn't shown that ability at all... Nice pick up by the Pens getting PONI...
Rhet0ric
BREAK UP THE RANGERS!!! That was a quick 4 goals...
Rhet0ric
RF4L - totally agree on Dreary. Watched every minute of his games. He was okay, nothing great, killed penalties all right and scored an open netter vs Canada in the prelimin ,round and another against Norway. Big deal. He was invisible the last three games and only played 10-12 minutes. Dreary equals over rated and over paid. I don't hate him but i hate the fact that he is our captain and hate the money he's costing us. He's not worth four Callahans, (salary) In fact I would take Cally straight up. Trade him now while some people may think he has value, but unfortunately the rest of the GM's aren't as bloody stupid as our Genious. Cheers.
MC
I'm not convinced Korp can't mature into a solid 3rd liner, but I think it's clear it would be pretty tough to do that in RangerLand. That's in large part because virtually every young forward who comes through the Ranger pipeline to NY is just that - a 3rd liner. You cannot develop them all - there's simply no room for them all! Lisin appears to have more skill offensively than Korp - Sather, I'm sure, was hoping he'd realize that in New York. Alas, with the constant pressure to make the 8th or 7th PO spot plus the overall dysfunctional roster, the environment to develop when you're suspect to begin with simply isn't there. It really is a mess when you think about it from that perspective anyways...
RF4L
Slegs: I say we go 8 - 12 over the last 20 games ..... from there, Slats should be able to trade up to a top 5 pick ...... The only one doing Coke is Dolan ..... Maybe Glennie's his Coke-Whore .....
mf
mf things go better with coke.... a cola........so what will be the record for the last 20? 10-10 better or worse?
stevielegs
NYR ...WHO's HOT... Michal Rozsival (D) 2 pts in last 2 GP, Matt Gilroy (D) 3 pts in last 5 GP, Vaclav Prospal (LW/C) 8 pts in last 5 GP, Erik Christensen (C/LW) 3 pts in last 2 GP, Olli Jokinen (C) 5 pts in last 5 GP, Chris Drury (C/RW) 2 pts in last 2 GP.... WHO's COLD... Dan Girardi (D) 0 pts in last 9 GP, Wade Redden (D) 0 pts in last 5 GP, Marc Staal (D) 1 pts in last 4 GP, Ryan Callahan (RW/LW) 0 pts in last 3 GP, Brandon Dubinsky (C/LW) 3 pts in last 12 GP...
Rhet0ric
Great Slegs, torture me / us some more... thought you were a friend :-0, "sadist" bet you're a liberal too.....
mf
TD.Some feel that torts isn't part of the problem but he wanted those guys Higgins,Kotalik Brashere,Lisin, Slats signed them yeah but would they al be here if Torts wasn't coaching the team?
ilya
mf: I probably shouldn't be saying this but I'm also rooting for a top 5 pick. I know there is no guarantee with the draft but I'd rather take my chances with the draft than the constant turnover and mediocracy that we currently have.
davidsoc30
mf he has until 3pm tomorrow
stevielegs
mf march 7th ;-)......don't rush sather he's making mistakes as fast as he can....................
stevielegs
Desi: Thats how it is in Rangerland. We're damned either way. Might as well hang on to the youth that have promise and let the group gel & mature together. The constant turnover has not worked, (we're a 1 and done team) and its a crap shoot gone lucky when we finally get a few that mesh, ie: Prospal & Gabby .... Heres to a top 5 pick .... 5.5 hours left for Chomp to play the only hand he's good at; unwinding his previous bad moves... Fire Sather already, when is that March 7th rally?
mf
Vic - Agree totally on KORPIKOSKI. I never liked that deal, even though I did like LISIN...Korpikoski, however, DID give the Rangers more versatility. And while he didn't have the offensive skills of Lisin, I think he'll turn out to be a perfectly serviceable third-liner...I don't doubt the same with Lisn, who looked good with the Rangers and pretty much did EVERYTHING the club asked of him. But he quickly landed in TORTS' doghouse, and clearly he wasn't going to emerge...I don't doubt that he'll be claimed off waivers. VOROS, on the other hand, will be in Hartford come tomorrow afternoon...back to Korpikoski...another thing he brought that Lisin didn't: CONTINUITY. And this goes back to Sather/Torts trying to re-invent the wheel. I find it funny that a lot of the 'Torts' guys are already starting to vanish...First Kotalik and Higgins...then Brashear...now Lisin. You gotta wonder if Torts himself will follow them out the door if he fails to make the POs.
tdchi
I agree Vic let the kid play on the wing not center, I think it was York18 that said that playing with Jagr could ruin this kid because he was an in your face type player. York18 was right but watch as soon as we trade him he will become the player that we think he can be.
desi04
DESI: I like DUBI as well. The potential is there but the consistency is not. He needs to be taught to play like PF and not a finesse scorer. He has the body, skating ability and hands to be a really good PF. He is very good in the corners and behind the net. I would be very resistant to trading him or CALLY for that matter.
Vic
why hate on Dubinsky, 49 games -13 goals & 18 assists,+11, mark my words trade Dubi & he will be the next John Leclair. We all talk about how he should be a power forward & not a center. We will trade him & he will do exactly what Leclair did when traded to the flyers & put in as a power forward. Montreal - 91-92 season 59 games - 19 pts. 92-93 72 games 44pts- 93-94 74 games 43pts. I like Dubi.
desi04
VTRanger- No arguement....OLA - Some players jjust are not worth the commitment..Lisin and his 1-d, inconsistent game is one of them (in my eyes)..You are right, Korp or a pick would be more worthwhile..
Hospo
Hospo: Montoya and Korp were worthless 1st round picks, followed by worthless trades, all made by a worthless Pres./GM. Nuff said.
VtRanger
The marginals are so small at the top, that if you want that great width you need to build it yourself. Lisin have some talent, he could have become something. If we commited to him, and developed him. If we weren't prepaired to do that, I rather take a 7th rounder.
Ola
May as well trade them all....we are DOA-----Turn out the lightssssssssss, the partys over...................
thedugster
E: I disagree with your assessment of KORPIKOSKI vs LISIN. KORPIKOSKI could play C and play on 3rd or 4th line. He was defensively responsible and to tell you the truth I think he was every bit as fast a skater as LISIN. We could have kept KORPIKOSKI and tried to develop him and still had a serviceable 3rd or 4th line player. The same cannot be said of LISIN. There was no need to make that trade and it only served to make the Rangers weaker up the middle then they already were. I don't think either player will become a star but I think KORPIKOSKI has a chance to have a decent NHL career, while I think it unlikely that LISIN will ever make it.
Vic
E - Personally, I can't stand Lisin and the type of player he is...1 -dimensional AHL player in my eyes,..That being said, I was never a big fan of Korp and was constantl getting on people here when they were talking about him as a future steady 2nd or 3rd liner..I always saw him maybe as a 4th liner/PKer that could play a little both ways....which I take over a Lisin...I saw Korp earlier in the year and he looked pretty decent, but a quick look at his stats since the New Year doesn't show a pretty picture either....Like I said earlier, pretty much worthless trades with Phoenix...
Hospo
HOSPO: I saw no upside on Korp so I saw the trade of Lisin of no consequence. Korp has done nothing in PHX to suggest that he had some kind of untapped offense that we just missed out on. I still like Lisin. I think he is raw. Do I think he is going to be some kind of 50 goal scorer? No, but he is fast and he can shoot. He's a project but I still make this move with no regrets.
E
Chelly was never a speedster-but I bet he can beat Girardi in a race.
puckyou
RF4L - yeah, Ottawa's defesne is damn solid with Volchenkov, Phillips,Sutton,Kuba,Carkner with Karlsson/Campioli...That will be a fairly nasty D to play against in the POs..and thay have a decent offense (not spectacular)with Spezza, Alfredsson, Kovalev,Fisher and Michalek...And they were going to cumnble without Heatlley..:)..Very good job by their GM
Hospo
RF4L: Can't be. Only SATHER would give CHELIOS a contract like that. Of course, SATHER would insist that CHELIOS have a No Movement Clause as well.......
Vic
Be careful what you wish for- Chelios has to pass through waivers before atlanta can call him up. And were only one point ahead of atlanta in the standings.
Messier11
HOSPO: LOL! Great minds think alike....
Vic
Vic: Agreed - unless he's signed for 4 years at $5,500,000/per of course.
RF4L
Also, big game for the Sens - 1 point ahead of Buffalo for the division and a guaranteed home PO series in the opening round.
RF4L
RF4L: Honestly, who would rather have under contract and on your roster right now all things considered.....REDDEN, SOURAY or CHELIOS. Personally, I'd take CHELIOS.......
Vic
RF4L - Unfortuantely, I might take Chelios over 5 of our Defenseman if the choice was for a few games this year...
Hospo
BTW, it's highly unlikely the Rangers will win tonight. Ottawa has played very well since about December. The only way they win, IMO, is if the King stands on his head.
RF4L
Hey, the Rangers missed out apparently on one of their Stanley Cup pieces - the Thrashers apparently signed Chris Chelios today!
RF4L
Bob et al: I don't have even a single ounce of confidence that Sather won't do a boneheaded trade. It's pathetic but for me, it's not a matter of IF, it's a matter of the magnitude of the boneheadedness. Last year is a perfect example: Neither move was of major consequence, but giving up a 2nd rounder and 2 minddling prospects for what in hindsight, amounts to ZIP was just plain dumb. Funny thing is, I didn't like either trade because I knew even collectively, they wouldn't make a difference in terms of any Ranger PO push.
RF4L
Sather incompetence? Marek Zidlicky signed a 3 year extension today in Minnesota. He was discarded and belittled by Sather years ago. The guy has been a productive NHLer, and played on his country's Olympic team. He still has the keys to the ship called Rangers. Iceberg ahead.
Bob
DREW: LOL, no but he did wonders with the Lindros for Johnsson, Hlavac, and BRENDL swap!!!
RF4L
Now wait a minute RF4L! You are going to tell me that we didn't make out on the Jamie Lundmark / Jeff Taffe swap?
DREW
Hospo: It's Sather grasping at straws due to his very mediocre drafting ability. Trading off lousy prospects for equally lousy prospects in other words, hoping he lucks out and hits a home room. Seems to me he's batting 000 so far!
RF4L
VIC - Thanks for the info on the DEADLINE..and bingo on Lisin..A worthless move for 1-diimensional worthless player...Wasted Korp on him..like we wasted a draft pick on Boytano..
Hospo
As for LISIN, I think he represents another example of SATHER's incompetence. What was the purpose of bringing him here? Anyone with a brain knew that this was a kid that needed a lot of development if you were going to make him into a consistent top 6 forward. He was a defensive liability so you weren't bringing him in to replace SHOE or play a meaningful role on a 3rd or 4th line. The only way it makes sense to bring a guy like LISIN in is if you plan to suck for a few years and don't mind taking the time to try to develop him. That was never going to be the case here so why bother???!? The only possible end for him was getting waived or traded. What was the point! Just a waste of time, and by association, a First Round Draft Pick. Nice job GLENN!!!
Vic
Just to make sure everyone knows, the trade deadline is 3PM Eastern Time tomorrow. It isn't midnight tonight.
Vic
Zipay saying that although waived, Lisin will dress tonight. maybe they intend to send him down. Voros will not dress.
Messier11
And man, you goota love those eventful trades we have done with Phx..what was it, Hossa and Montoya for Sjostrom/Leneve and then Pruca/Dawes for Morris...and then Korp for Lisin...Why bother?
Hospo
OILERS_INSIDER... is saying not to expect any HEALTHY scratches tonight for the OIL because the player going to the NYR is already on the IR (SOURAY)...
Rhet0ric
Maybe OTT has to trade Volchenkov for money reasons? If not, they have put together a real good defense with Sutton, who I would love to have...
Hospo
Sutton was traded for a draft pick... it doesn't say what round yet though...
Rhet0ric
Sutton for 2nd rounder previously belonged to San Jose
puckyou
Andy Sutton traded to Ottowa-don't know for who yet
puckyou
Mess11-Bob Mackenzie confirmed also.
puckyou
Larry Brooks reported Lisin on waivers via Twitter
Rhet0ric
puckyou- who's reporting? who confirmed?
Messier11
Well, with Lisin on waivers, that means we've now given Phoenix two of our 1st round picks with absolutely nothing left in return. Way to build a franchise.
VtRanger
Mess11-Lisin confirmed on waivers
puckyou
Zipay only saying Lisin may be on waivers. leaves room for doubt.
Messier11
Any info on Gabbie's injury? Is it his cut knee or groin? I am wondering if the latter has flaired up because due to playing with the former not healed properly, he ended up favouring it and therefore, injuried his groin. If so, leave him in the infirmiary until he's fully healed. There's too much money and too much importance invested in this guy to risk another crippling injury.
RF4L
Gotta figure the Voros and Lisin waiver move is to free up cap space, which means Sather is likely positioning the team to acquire a salary of some significance (ie a vet). Neither will be missed, although I echo Hospo's thoughts on Voros' heart. Alas, he's simply a lousy hockey player due to his inability to skate - couple that with his mediocre fighting ability and he likely will be playing in a few days where he really belongs - the AHL.
RF4L
td: I think almost everyone on the Rangers is tradeable, save for the King and Gabbie and perhaps Staal. I'm not saying a guy like Dubi is purposely being shopped nor am I pushing for him to go, but you gotta give to get something of value. I, too, would love to see Rozey (and Redden) moved, but no way are you going to get a Mueller for Rozey. Nor will you get Horton for Rozey. Dubi and Rozey and a valid prospect for McCabe and Horton to me is more realistic (again, not saying I'm for that trade, just saying it's more realistic in terms of value going either way). Interestingly enough when you consider how some criticize Dubi on here, he seems to be involved in plenty of rumours, which tells me he is still considered highly by opposing GMs.
RF4L
With Brashear gone and Voros and Lisin on waivers plus Gabby and Del Zotto out aren't we a tad short on bodies?
DanyloHalytskyj
Probably a contact thing with MDZ. I'm not a doctor (nor do I play one online), but I would imagine a 50-stitch gash would take awhile to heal.
Zebop
If it wasn't after a long lay off, I would say it would be good that Del Zotto had some time off---his play needed it..But not after the break...That cut must be having a hard time healing..
Hospo
Lisin - another garbage pickup along with Kotallik, Higgins, Brshear, Boyle ....No problem with him joining the list of outgoing players...Ditto with Voros, even if i do like him for his heart and guts..
Hospo
MDZ out too
puckyou
Brooks says Gabby out tonight. Hope it's just for tonight.
puckyou
What I was afraid about when we got Lisin. That we never were going to give him a real chance. Slats treats kids like they are lottery picks. Like he dreams that one day he will trade for a Lisin and get a Pavel Bure. That will NEVER happened. A kid like Lisin needs to be DEVELOPED. Give him 3-4 years and he could have become a decent player. Like Martin Straka was one type of player when he was 23 y/o, and a completely different type of player when he was 33 y/o. But its 100% pointless to get him, and then only give him 2/3 of a season. Completely pointless.
Ola
Voros & Lisin on waivers
puckyou
Girardi is with the team, Gaborik not on the ice at practice. http://twitter.com/jaygeemsg/statuses/9881397376
DREW
OK, i'm lazy, when exactly is the trade deadline?..As for the Rangers D, Roszival is far superior to that wuss Girardi, but once you take salary into account it's another story..I would love to see both gone by next year. (ditto for Redden)..Girardi gets so exposed on the first or 2nd pair of defense...
Hospo
RF4L - Count me as one who does NOT want to see GIRARDI go....He's been a solid defender, and I'd much rather get rid of a guy who has been inconsistent at best, such as ROZSIVAL or REDDEN...personally, I think the whole GABORIK fight was an issue that was seriously blown out of proportion, especially considering that Girardi would have certainly been giving a game misconduct plus five minutes for being the third man in during a 1-0 game...Had it been a blowout or were that piss-poor rule not in place, I wouldn't doubt he would have been in there...BUT...if its a straight-up deal and PHOENIX is talking about MUELLER, I'd do it in a heartbeat...On another note, I really hope all this bluster about DUBINSKY is rooted in the twittermania. Someone was posting on Carp's site about the Rangers talking to the Kitties about Horton and McCabe for Dubi, Sangs and a pick...Still, I really doubt Sather is dealing DUBINSKY. I think if he had any intention of doing that, he would have moved him during the contract impasse. I hope at least...
tdchi
One of the few strengths Sather has shown is his ability to trade away or unwind unwanted players and their contracts.....So, come on now Glennie Boy, you've got 12 hours and 34 minutes, you can do it, come on now, pull it off.... and then, "Retire!" (end of rant)
mf
Ret - I agree with your point on Team USA and lack of real superstar type players like Canada - and did ya notice the distinct lack of any Rangers on that Canadian Superstar laden team? I still maintain and always will that to be a Stanley cup championship caliber team you need at least one or two of those Canadian superstar caliber players. Go back and look at all the championship teams through the years - they are never (or rarely) lead by US or Euro players. A trend that Sather and the Rangers are looking to buck? good luck! ... Newfie - we have been awful at home this year so maybe playing all those games away will help?
NYStranger
Souray? Please.Hopefully not....Just anoher player to make the Rangers less intersting..but if it's a swap for Redden, I guess it's a GI=GO type of deal.....And Girardi couldn;t be gone sooner..talk about somebody that has regressed....C'mon Glennie, get those vets in here...!
Hospo
Road games VS Home games.................we have 20 games left to make the PO's..........however ,of the last 10 games, SEVEN of them are on the road (six in a row)..........any thoughts ? In the past hasn't our strength always been at HOME ?
Newfie_Ranger
Rhet/Danylo: I've been speculating for quite some time that Phoenix may be looking at a Ranger d-man, hopefully for Mueller. If Sather can pull something like that off, kudos to him. Mueller is no saviour and given the way he's played this year, likely won't be of much help this season, but he's young and talented and a top 6 forward - therefore, he's desperately what this team is sorely lacking. I know he's not liked much on here, but other than his inexplicable reluctance to jump into the Cancerillor/Gabbie fight, I don't have a problem with Girardi. He's in the top 10 in the league in hits and is still young, meaning he's got room to grow. In other words, he's not crap and therefore, should fetch something decent in a trade.
RF4L
That's interesting considering that Phoenix is rumored to be looking for help on the back end.
DanyloHalytskyj
Rumor going around the boards today was that GIRARDI was taken out of practice yesterday and was not on the flight to OTTAWA... Anyone care to speculate?
Rhet0ric
TD... the way I look at it... He's a win/win/win for us... his contract is less for less years... if he's healthy, he's better than REDDEN... if he's hurt, one of the kids get's to play... If he's hurt real bad, we get to replace his salary... of course I only want him as long as we get rid of one of our bad contracts in the deal... ALSO, his NTC expires on July 1st ... C'mon drink the Kool Aid with me :) ...RF4L... Totally agree with you on PARISE... he really impressed me(despite being a DEVIL... it was also glaring to me how Team USA had a lack of SUPERSTAR's on the team, especially when compared with the talent of CANADA...
Rhet0ric
A few other thoughts on WILSON rolling 4 lines at the Olympics that I think you guys need to consider. First, he really had no choice. The games were played at a much higher intensity and pace. There were fewer whistles and NO TV TIMEOUTS every 3 to 5 minutes. If he were to try to roll two or three lines his team would have been gassed half way through each of the first two periods and they would have been dog meat in the third. Also, keep in mind that his 4th liners were 2nd/3rd liners on their NHL teams. The drop off in play when they were on the ice is much less then you would normally have. He wasn't afraid to have his 4th line out there against other team's top line because he knew they wouldn't get exploited. If you guys remember, the NHL changed the TV timeout rules about 10 or 15 years ago. When they did a lot of teams that used to roll 4 lines realized they could get their star players rested and back on the ice more often. I remember this being a big deal for LEMIEUX and the Pens. Rolling 4 lines in the NHL just isn't as necessary as it used to be and isn't as necessary as it was in the Olympics.
Vic
There's a good reason Kovalchuk came relatively cheap and that is because the KHL is planning to make him their poster boy next season after they lose JJ back to the NHL.
DanyloHalytskyj
Rhet - I think you're placing WAY too much stock in SOURAY. His value is just about at zero right now for the Oil. First of all, I'm not sure if you've taken a gander at his +/- lately, but it's bad. Real bad. In fact, it's been bad for quite some time. The guy is a large defender, but one who if you can get around him, he's not going to catch you on the back check...Second...Souray himself kind of poisoned his own stock by prematurely asking for a trade. I've heard the situation between him and Edmonton is mutual, and it was clear when he publicly said he'd waive his NTC, that was indicative of the bad blood...also realize Souray is about as damaged as they come...He's coming off a REAL bad concussion...and he was boneheaded enough to get in a fight(the one that broke his hand) AFTER basically asking for a trade...Then there's the comments DANEYKO made the other day, saying Souray has a losing mentality. If I remember correctly, the weren't exactly comments that were solicited either...also...that NTC doesn't get wiped off the books when Souray joins his new club....they've got the guy for two years at $5.4 million per. ...Now look at the going market...it's kind of apples and oranges...but KOVALCHUK didn't land the Thrash even a third of what most pundits thought the deal would...I wouldn't doubt the notion that these guys are part of a broader deal between these clubs....or that it's the machinations of a twisted twitter moron pulling one over on the fans(the same guy said VISHNEVSKY is coming to the Bruins, who have ZERO cap space)...But the truth is, the folks in Edmonton are regarding Souray with almost as much disdain as the standard Ranger fan regards Redden(who is also younger, BTW).
tdchi
Rhet: I'd do Redden and Dubi and a prospect for Souray and Cogiliano (assuming it's not blue chip prospect).
RF4L
Vic: Agreed 100%. I've been saying it for 2 years - Drury is a 3rd liner making 1st line money. It's another silly contract courtesy of the incompetent Glen Sather.
RF4L
td: I only watched the 2 US/Canada matches, so I'll defer to you with regards to how Drury played overall. I did notice him a lot in the first US/Canada game, but didn't so much on Sunday's game. I also agree on rolling 4 lines - Wilson tries to do that with the Leafs on a regular basis.
RF4L
RF4L: I would also like to add that DRURY and CALLY were the top PK pair for TEAM USA so they were on the ice for 60 to 90 seconds during each PK. The other thing is that DRURY didn't play any better under RENNEY so what LB really needs to ask is the same question I asked last week (Why is DRURY playing better in the Olympics then he has as a Ranger?). There are probably a dozen factors that contributed to that including 1) The team around DRURY was better and he elevated his play because of it. 2) He was being used more in line with his age and ability. 3) He played harder in the tournament for his country. Does TORTS share some responsibility for DRURY's lack of production in NY? Yes, he does......but so does SATHER for the putrid team that he has assembled and so does DRURY. The fact remains that SATHER is paying him $7Mil a year. A guy making 1/7th to 1/8th of your cap hit can't be playing 10 minutes or less a night in a PK and 4th line role.
Vic
RF4L - As someone who watched every minute of Team USA's remarkable run(and the win over Canada twice), I definitely agree with Brooks. DRURY looked far better than he does with the Rangers, and was one of the players that really hit the ice during critical moments. My one slight disagreement is that I don't think his role was supremely different than on the Rangers...Wilson was using him and CALLAHAN as his top PK'ers, and he was using Drury to win key faceoffs. But Brooks is 100 percent right: He looked like a different player...the Drury that many of us thought we were getting when he signed...Granted, the stat sheet might not show it. But he was definitely a key component of that team...Brooks is also spot-on in his assessment of rolling lines...THAT right there has been one of my largest beefs with TORTORELLA...You simply can't win in the modern NHL with two lines. And it always seems that's the game he wants to play...personally, I REALLY hope Torts learned something from the games...if anyone brings back anything, I hope its him. Because while many of you blame their mediocre record on the Rangers' poor construction, I think their record is FAR more indicative of the piss-poor job the guy behind the bench has done with a team largely of his own creation.
tdchi
VIC/RF4L/STEVIE... I agree 100%... It's probably something like SOURAY and COGLIANO for REDDEN, DUBI and a prospect... I doubt very much that CALLY or MDZ would be involved... VIC... It could be total BS... after the little he's show since he's been in NY, It's hard to believe that anyone could have any interest in REDDEN at all...
Rhet0ric
What is LB talking about re Drury?? In the gold medal game he played under 10 minutes, had a single shot on net and zero points. In the semi-final, he had 11 and 1/2 minutes of icetime, 1SOG and zero points. In the quarter finals, in 13 minutes, 1 shot and 0 points. In the US vs Canada preliminary game, he had 14 minutes, 2 SOG and a goal. In US's 2nd prelim game against Norway, he logged 10 minutes of icetime, 1 SOG and 1 goal. And in US's opening game, just over 9 minutes, with 2 SOG and zero points. In total, therefore, Drury scored 2 goals in 6 games and averaged about 11 minutes of icetime per. Those 2 goals represent a 33% scoring clip which is double the meagre output he's managed this year with the Rangers, although it's worthy to note, IMO, that he didn't put up even a single point in the 3 elimination games. Even more interesting considering the angle of LB's article was praising WIlson's handling of Drury vs Tortorella's, but clearly, is looking at the icetime on a game by game basis. WIlson started off the tourney unimpressed with Drury's play, then increased his icetime as the preliminary round progressed. However, as the stakes grew higher (ie the elimination round commenced) Wilson reduced that icetime on a game by game basis. So just what did Wilson do, besides REDUCE Drury's icetime, that Tortorella doesn't do???
RF4L
stevie: Agreed - hence my theorizing someone like Dubi or MDZ or a 1st is included. Either that or it's a bigger trade involving multiple players. I'm not a Souray fan, but in a case of it being a lesser of 2 evils thing, I'd take him over Redden in a heartbeat.
RF4L
BTW, Zach Parise to me showed in the Olympics, especially in the gold medal game, that he's clearly a top 10 NHLer. SATHER SUCKS!
RF4L
RF4L no way it's straight up, unless they are drinking that way in Oiler town. Sather will have to pay to shed Deadden. I hope he's man enough. There's is almost zero need for his presence on D. Sourey is the type needed, but he comes with baggage too.
stevielegs
Not for a second do I believe Lowe is even remotely considering swapping Redden for Souray. It makes zero sense and there's a reason everyone on this board perked up when it was posted - because it would be a GREAT trade. Not great because of who the Rangers would be getting, but because one of the worse contracts in NHL history would be gone. I suspect if there is any truth to that rumour, it needs more fleshing out - like Redden and Dubinsky/Callahan/MDZ/first round pick for Souray.
RF4L
VIC maybe but the claim is......."...# Bio Currently employed at the Oilers head office. IF I hear or see something I will post as long as it is not detrimental to the team.".....http://twitter.com/oilers_insider
stevielegs
Rhet: That may all be true but LOWE would have to be a walking moron to still have interest in REDDEN after watching him since he came to the Rangers. Most of The Wall was against the signing even before it happened. We had seen with our own eyes that REDDEN's game had dropped off significantly in his last two years with the Sens. There were some who believed that all he needed was a change in scenery. SATHER was obviously one of them. Maybe LOWE was too but there is no way that he couldn't/wouldn't know better now. The more I thought about that blog that STEVIE linked yesterday the more I thought it was BS. I think it is just some guy (or kid) who is having a little fun posting ECKLUND like trade "rumors".
Vic
Rhet0ric - interesting. I didn't know Lowe had that much interest in Redden. I wonder how much influence Lowe has with trades these days. Do you think he could talk Steve Tambellini into Redden?
DREW
....from ?......"To the Sports Editor: “For Canada’s Faithful, a Gold That Means Most,” March 1, captured the true and exact feeling of Canadians. John Branch has explained, as only a good and close neighbor could, the importance of our national sport. Strange in a way that this should come from one of our greatest rivals. You captured our feelings toward the win of our game so well. It brought tears to my eyes and I felt the need to share with our American friends how much we appreciate such kind respect. Americans, like the game of hockey itself, have trouble understanding the intricacies of the more recent international history of the game. Yes, it’s true, Canada went 50 years without winning an Olympic hockey gold medal, but it wasn’t because the game was “slowly slipping away” from us. There was the issue of top Communist national teams under the guise they weren’t professionals playing our amateur kids. In response, there were several Winter Olympics Canada refused to participate in hockey at all. Sunday’s game will most likely make the top 10 moments of Canada’s international hockey history, but hardly stands alone in a nation with so many past heroes and great international hockey moments. A thanks for your lovely story on Canadian hockey and what it means to us — from a Canadian over the moon with our win Sunday night. This was a truly lovely and friendly piece that touched my heart. It also reminds me of how gracious Americans can be. It could have been anyone’s game: your guys played awesomely and your goaltender is the best in the world right now. Thanks for being part of our great hockey memory. It means so much to us when our “big brother” takes note and celebrates with us. I watched this gold medal game today. As a Canadian, I cannot find words right now to describe how incredible this hockey was. Only the USA and Canada could play a game of hockey like this. This was a game for the history books. Remember to heap praise on this American hockey team. Thank these boys for playing hockey the way it’s supposed to be played: fast and rough and without table manners. Remember to tell these American hockey players that you are proud of them. They play North American-style hockey, the hockey we Canadians play on the beaver ponds and flooded fields and outdoor rinks up here, not the wimpy, whiny, cry-to-the-ref European style, which doesn’t even deserve to be played on North American rinks. This was the best game of hockey I have ever watched. And I’ve seen a lot of them. This is beyond Stanley Cup hockey. This is as good as it gets. Thank you, United States Olympic hockey team, for being exactly half the reason this game was so exciting. And although you didn’t win the gold, you are quite worthy of that medal, believe me. Hold your heads high, lads."......i don't completely agree but it sounds nice ..........
stevielegs
from lb..."... Perhaps USA assistant and Rangers head coach John Tortorella was paying attention when Team USA head coach Ron Wilson gave Drury a role and stuck with it. Perhaps Tortorella was paying attention when Wilson rolled three and four lines instead of trying to win the tournament by relying on six forwards. Drury played his best hockey of the year in Vancouver. He looked, if one will pardon the expression, like Chris Drury; hunting the puck on the forecheck, creating chances, sniffing for and converting loose change around the net. Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/rangers/rescue_ranger_R5qXBGwZb8N35jeWoaClTM#ixzz0h1JjJZsq .......why was captain crutch different? Same guy different coach, different team........
stevielegs
TD... Not too many organizations would be happy with burying $23 MIL in the minors... who knows if DOLAN would even sign off on it... this may be our one lone chance to get rid of him... I also have to disagree with you on SOURAY, I think he's got a lot more defensive ability than REDDEN... besides, he only has 2 years left on his deal... and if he gets hurt, a kid get's to play in his place... VIC...Reportedly, LOWE was interested in signing REDDEN before he signed his last contract with OTTAWA... then looked into trading for him while he was there... and he also wanted to sign him the year that we did... maybe LOWE think's he can turn him around...
Rhet0ric
Congrats to Stevie Y. and the rest of the Canadian team.
iggy
Thrashers land Artyukhin from DucksMonday, 03.01.2010 / 9:23 PM / 2010 NHL Trade Deadline NHL.com7 Share The Atlanta Thrashers acquired forward Evgeny Artyukhin from the Anaheim Ducks on Monday night in exchange for defenseman Nathan Oystrick and a conditional draft choice in the 2011 NHL Entry Draft. Artyukhin, 26, had 9 points (5 goals, 4 assists) in 37 games this season. The 6-foot-4, 255-pound right wing set career highs in games played (73), goals (6) and penalty minutes (151) in 2008-09 with the Tampa Bay Lightning. Overall, he has 42 points (14 goals, 28 assists) and 282 penalty minutes in 182 games between Anaheim and Tampa Bay. He was drafted by the Lightning in the third round (No. 94) in the 2001 Entry Draft. Oystrick, 27, had 23 points (7 goals, 16 assists) and a plus-6 rating in 41 games with the Chicago Wolves in the American Hockey League this season. He appeared in 53 games with the Thrashers during his rookie season in 2008-09, notching 12 points (4 goals, 8 assists). The 6-foot, 205-pound defenseman has 114 points (37 goals, 77 assists) in 203 career AHL games with the Wolves. Oystrick was selected by the Thrashers in the seventh round (No. 198) of the 2002 Entry Draft. EMAIL ›| |MORE SHARE › |PRINT ›
mf
RF4L - Never say never...
tdchi
Guaranteed Kesler is going nowhere.
RF4L
I C people bustin Rafalski for his play in the OT.. I think he was overused.. at some point on the Canadiam broadcast I am sure they said he 'd played about 30 minutes.. so my guess it was fatigue .. which usually is the culprit in OT.. perhaps some blame lay at Wilson's feet for not evening out the ice time of the D ...Just sayin'
sjw
If we do get Souray hoepuflly he can become Shanny like only on the blueline add leadership toughness and cannon of the shot.
ilya
Vic- To be honest, I kind of doubt Vancouver would move him either...if anything, I'd say such a move would be a draft-day deal, or maybe before RFA negotiations begin. Agreed too, that's pretty steep price for his past production. But his numbers just keep getting better and better. In my opinion, he out-shined STASTNY in the Olympics, and was the Yanks' best pivot. In NY, he'd easily slide into first-line center detail. And honestly, he's got all the skills this team could really use...hard edge...good PKer and can dish out the puck. Him and GABORIK on a line would be DANGEROUS...On SOURAY...Personally, I think the guy is a step away from garbage. I have a feeling he'd be the defenseman version of KOTALIK...so if its Souray for Redden straight up, in a NY minute. Souray for Redden and a pick. Sure. But Souray for Redden and a quality prospect(Sanguinetti), I think I'd be hesitant to do it. Ditching Redden would be great. But he can easily be sent to Hartford too..I wouldn't be loading up a potential Redden deal with anything that would have lasting repercussions in the future(i.e., top prospects or a first/second rounder). The most I'd give a team to take Redden if they're giving a large contract back would be a third rounder or so.
tdchi
TD: I would LOVE to get KESLER. He is a better and more mature version of DUBI. I would think that Vancouver would want to keep him at almost any cost although $5Mil per year is pretty steep for him based on his career production.
Vic
Dennis Grebeshkov dealt from Edmenton to Nashville for a 2nd rounder.
evets1980
STEVIE: I know there is almost zero chance of the Rangers being sellers but I can always hope! As for the rumored SOURAY for REDDEN deal.....if those are the only players involved I would do that deal in a heartbeat. I can't imaging why the Oilers would be even slightly interested in something like that. There has to be more to it. There must be a young Ranger prospect going to the Oilers as well. Why would they (of all teams) want to take on REDDEN's contract. It just doesn't make sense.
Vic
stevie- that'd be pretty ideal.
Messier11
CALLAHAN's value is probably at an all-time high right now, after he had a very effective Olympic tourney. But with that said, he's on my list of Rangers who I wouldn't trade, unless it were for someone like BOBBY RYAN or RYAN KESLER...This includes Staal, MDZ, Anismov, Dubinsky, Lundqvist, and Gaborik...BTW...The Canucks now have SEDIN and KESLER up the middle. Next season, they'll probably have HODGSON in the bigs...Ditto with SCHROEDER. That means they've got two number-one centers...and two possible number-one center...Kesler is an RFA this year and has broken off contract talks with the Canucks...He's supposedly looking for a multi-year deal in the range of $5 million per. Canucks are offering $4 million...Wonder if they'd be interested in working out a deal...if not for Kesler...maybe Hodgson? That's the kind of deal I'd love to see Sather try...And we here at the wall all know I've got a hankerin' for them to trade something(anything except Hank) for BOBBY RYAN too...
tdchi
do it.......http://twitter.com/oilers_insider
stevielegs
vic.....http://www.newsday.com/sports/hockey/rangers/prospal-wants-to-stay-a-ranger-1.1781446........sather will not be a seller, he needs to make the playoffs........
stevielegs
I can see it now....Rangers trade Ryan Callahan and a first round pick in 2010 to Colorado for David Koci and future considerations....that would be Sathers style would it not?
Wildcard
E: I agree. If SATHER can't land a young current/future star playmaking Center then I'd rather just seem them do nothing at the deadline. My real choice would be to try move DRURY, ROSI, REDDEN and PROSPAL for draft picks and young prospects but that isn't going to happen.
Vic
Frolov: a few things. 1. I think he is a better player then his stats are showing. 2. He used to have a penchant for "small" goals although he has become somewhat a big game player albeit with less production. 3. He is a pretty flexible kid. He can play many different roles. 4. He is the type of player that doesn't produce a lot of wow factor. I wouldn't trade a lot for him, but I also really see the need for another underproducing 2nd tier player. This team needs game-breakers, power forwards, and defensive snarl. Frolov does not address any of this.
E
puck I think he looks like a mouse.
stevielegs
Count me in as one not sold on Frolov. And getting Karable would be silly, too - the Rangers need a thumping d-man, not another soft non-physical player. Karable is quite skilled, but soft as fresh pastry. No rent-a-vet moves please and thank you!!!
RF4L
Rhet – Because Z wouldn't cost Sanguinetti. Period. I don't really understand the logic of getting FROLOV, especially since its going to be a bitch to resign him and JOKINEN, if there's any interest in doing either...Frolov is a big body to throw on the left side...Nevertheless...don't put too much stock in my comment about Z. As we discussed here last week, KHL imports need to go through waivers, meaning a team needs to offer a high salary to get them here unclaimed(although the Rangers are eighth on the waiver wire).
tdchi
Stevie-you were not alone in the bad karma dept. I was making horse noises every time they showed Cindy's face-laughed after the breakaway & just seconds before the goal when he tried to split the D & got stood up. Subtle part of the Game winning play on the boards was the puck hitting the ref's skate , Iginla picks it up and passes to Mr. Ed-game over.
puckyou
First chance to post following the game yesterday. Contrats to team Canada and to all of our Canadian fans. It was a tough pill to swallow but I can't complain. The US team has nothing to be ashamed about. They played a great tournament and took a team that was a lot more skilled and experienced then they were to Overtime in the Gold Medal game. The fact is that USA hockey is getting better and better. Our development pipeline is almost as good as Canada's right now and in another decade it may actually be better. Some would say that we are already there given the success of the US Juniors teams, etc. I still think we have a little ways to go but we are close. I also wanted to take the opportunity to say that this tournament was right up there with the best hockey I have ever had the pleasure to watch. The tempo, skill, physicality and hustle were head and shoulders better then anything in the NHL. Very rarely there is a playoff series that rivals what we saw in these Olympics. The officiating was better as well as the referees did not call the ticky-tack garbage and just let them play. If it was an obvious penalty it got called. If it was anywhere near borderline it didn't. My only gripe is that I have to wait 4 years to see hockey of this quality again. One last thing.......since I'm not a CROSBY hater the fact that he scored the tournament winner didn't particularly bother me. You can say what you want about him but at the end of the day he came through and won the game for his team. I will add that the pass that IGINLA made to get him that scoring chance was AWESOME.
Vic
HOSPO I got accused of cursing the outcome by gloating on siisy choking on her breakaway in the 3rd that would have ended the game in regulation. They might have been right ;-)
stevielegs
Gotta say, I watched a grand total of 1 period of Olympic Hockey and really didn't care about the outcome, but it does indeed suck that scumbag Sidney scored the winner......Oh well.....So, what's going on with the RANGERS? I just read this morning that they claimed AULD, right? Decent move if true.......Intersting to see if the team comes out stromng like the last few games before the break..Also intersting to see how much of a BUYER Sather will be and how much young assets he will give up...
Hospo
Ret- I love Kaberle. But its a shame that he plays the same side as MDZ. BUT, I do not think Toronto will move him. With Dion, Kaberle and Schenn they have a blueline that have "cup" potential. If they move him, they really create a hole to fill a hole. I at least wouldn't move him if I were Burke, unless of course I could get a great pice in return. But who is going to move like a Getzlaf/Carter for Kaberle? Odds are small for a deal like that to occur. Dubinsky for Kaberle? Yeah, I would pull that trade. Dump Redden in HFD and let him terminate his contract, he have made his dough here in NY and only have himself to blame for scoring less then 20 pts. Then Id deal Rozsival in the summer. At the same time, its such a biatch that both Staal, Kaberle and MDZ would ply on the same side.
Ola
Thought of the day: Losing sucks. Crybaby with the winner sucks even more! ... great tournament though, despite the crummy analysis of "Edzo," who can't seem to let a replay roll without offering a 10-minute dissertation. Anyone else yelling SHUT UP at the tv like i was? ... Hockey proven yet again to be the greatest game in the world.
Zebop
OLA... KABERLE would be the PP quarterback that SATHER has long craved, but I can't see trading Cally for him... I have no problem trading CALLY, but I'd much rather get youth in return... If by some miracle we can get rid of ROZI and REDDEN, I'd like to see us build our D from LUNDQVIST out... with guys that compliment him(a la BRODEUR)... instead of the usual mish-mosh we always end up with... RF4L... I can almost taste that bad trade coming... 2 weeks of GM's with nothing to do but talk trade and all we get is one deal?... TD... FROLOV is a FA after this season, you would basically be trading ROZI to clear out cap space... but you'd rather re-sign a guy that no team in the NHL wanted? Personally, I don't think we'll see either of the R&R boys traded until the offseason(if at all)...
Rhet0ric
Pete - I too was astounded by the 4-on-4...I understood why they were doing it in the tournament games...but the medal round? Ridiculous. And as much as I hated the way that game ended, I would prefer that kind of win over a shootout. I would have lost my shit if the medal game was decided that way.
tdchi
The first goal yesterday really pissed me off. Johnson (#6) made a stupid pass to Rafalski at the side of the net, rather than a safer breakout up the boards-Rafalski was covered, coughed it up, bang-in the net. Just an avoidable play. rafalski-as great as he was a week before against Canada-had a crappy game yesterday. Besides the winning goal gaffe, his passes were off the entire game, he looked like crap. Patrick Kane is a stud-ditto for Parise. Cally & Drury played well also. Miller is better than King-IMO.
puckyou
Great game, but can someone please explain the OT thought-process. I know a shootout is a necessity to avoid a long game which would delay closing ceremonies, but why is OT 4 on 4? That changes the entire game and basically forces both teams to result to pond hockey to settle the gold medal game. What is wrong with 5 on 5 and then a shootout. The only reason the NHL uses 4 on 4 is b/c both teams get a point, so it is more for the fans. I don't get it.
pete
On the officiating.........here is what surprised me. Crosschecking, slashing and interference did not appear to be penalties. The Canadians adjusted very well to this, particularly with pick plays in the offensive zone. On the positive side,they adjusted as this went on all tournament long. I like the no-touch icing. Are there different rules in IIHF, or does th NHL just apply them differently?
Bob
There's nothing for me to say about that game, other than my fridge has a few fresh dents in it and I'm mighty hungover right now...YORK - I agree. I saw LUONGO blatantly deck a guy outside of the crease. There was a clear trip...no call...oh well...great game anyway. It's a shame it had to go down like that though...Penguins backline got better with LEOPOLD. I'm wondering if he'll finally start putting up numbers with all the offensive talent there...on the rumors...FROLOV sounds like a ZHERDEV reprise...why not just ditch ROZSIVAL for a pick and offer Z some cash to come back over? I'm leery of any forward having a career-worst season when he's playing with guys like Kopitar, Brown Doughty and some of the other big guns in LA...PONIKAROVSKY is interesting, but I agree...he'd only be a rental...Personally, I've grown pretty skeptical of Russian players. It seems like most of them are primadonas that allow their egos to dictate their play...I kind of wish Sather would target some young character guys...Most of the names that are being dangled out there give me any interest in what Sather is up to.
tdchi
payroll on I believe they said Canadian team was around $125 mil, that's way over the cap ;-)
stevielegs
And now back to the watered down NHL Buttman to bore you to death league
HamiltonHellhound
Leopold to Pens for 2nd rounder
puckyou
Morning All, just an FYI. I am no longer going by the username "endzone1." Anyone posting under that moniker is nowhere the hockey genius that I am! LOL!!!!!!
pa.rangersfan
The Olympics overall were great. So many wonderful things to think and talk about I could go on for hours. But for this board, here's one thing I enjoyed: No quotes from Tortorella!
RF4L
RangerGraham- This OG meant a lot more to other teams then Sweden. We just wasn't prepaired. For Canada/Russia it was extreme humiliation if they lost. For the US, it was a great chance. For Finland and Slovakie, it was the "last chance". For Sweden, it felt like the mood was something like "Another gold would be awsome on the resume" a long with very little pressure. I am pretty sure that a lot of people around our team are kind of pissed now, they never really gave it a go...
Ola
It was a game about getting the 1st goal. After that, Canada played like a team. And when you do that with these all-star rosters, you are hard to stop. I know many will think "what the hell is he talking about, they played like a team all a long", BUT, its always a scale. For example, after 1-0 Canada avg something like 25-30 second shifts. Small stuff like that paid dividends. Also, regarding the US, they were short on a couple of bigger stars. In a few years they will have that.
Ola
Great Olympics....onto the Rangers.... Lundqvist (ok tournament, not the 2006 Lundqvist......, expected Sweden to be on the podium, oh well he has a GOLD from past Olympics and only Hasek, Marty,Henrik and now Luongo have one) Gaborik (played with guts, gave his all. I really wanted Slovakia to take bronze) Jokinen ( big goals, the guy missed close in last Olympics against Lundqvist but played decent) Callahan, true grit for the U.S., Drury was someone I thought should not have made the team but he was oldschool Drury(clutch) Agree with those who say Kesler is great, he was the best forward out there for the US, as was Kane. with Parise still think Jessiman!!! Team Canada guys who look great : Toews, Nash,Weber and Doughty. Thinking Team Canada will have Luongo,Doughty,Keith,Weber, Toews,Richards,Nash,Getzlaf,Perry,the Shark line,Crosby,Stall and add in Duschesne,Stamkos,Taveras,Hall in 2014.
RangerGraham
SJW Sorry but the officiating was slightly biased. I can't remember how many times I saw Canada get awat with blatent interference =. Hell Cally got leveled from behind in open ice before the puck even got to him and USA got called for an icing because of it. That was one of just many. The game was decided on the ice, but Canada was given the home ice swallow the whistle favor any home team is given. Either way Canada won because of Rafalski not being smart enough to realize you don't let the kid go in alone and take pictures of him. The game was decided on the ice as it should be and not by a refs call, but at that point why bother having refs?
York18
Quote from the rumor site......The Rangers are a mess and could use a total overhaul. GM Glen Sather is incompetent, but there isn’t much left on his roster for poachers to nab. Who in their right mind would trade for Wade Redden? Sounds like he has the situation well-judged.
Bob
02.28.2010 11:33 am Rumors Heat Up As Trade Freeze Ends By Jeff Gordon ............ http://interact.stltoday.com/blogzone/hockey-guy/hockey-guy/2010/02/rumors-heat-up-as-trade-freeze-ends/
mf
Hey RF4L---missed the medal ceremony. Did the refs get theirs on the ice or in the referee's room? OK, just kidding. The USA played great and exceeded all expectations. It was a tremendous game. Too bad it ends on Miller's only mistake and off the stick of Lord Fauntleroy. With everything about the envireonment against them, the USA showed guts and character. Invaluable experience for the younsters on the team. Cally and Drury did well. My problem now is that, after this riveting tournament, we have to return to Slats' Sad Sack Capped Out heroes. Anticlimatic, IMO. Congrats Canada. Thanks for sharing your game with us. The gap continues to narrow..................................................................
Bob
it is enough to "miss" one call which can change the game...for me that one call was when US was on a pp. pronger cross-checked an american player (cant remember who it was) which should have given us a 5 on 3. the other was a cross-check on cally in the 3rd period. still a great game and US has nothing to be ashamed of. just wish we could have shot more...luongo was shakier than a mexican space shuttle
toporovski
I mean unbiased...lol....if Pony becomes a Ranger it's like last year's Antropov trade - a 2nd rounder. However, this time there's a very good chance Sather coughs up a pick from 35 to 40 and if so, another silly Sather decision.
RF4L
sjw: Agreed - watch what Langebrunner got away with and tell me it was biased officiating. That guy never plays like that when in a Devil uniform.
RF4L
Alexei Ponikarovsky will become a Blueshirt - Larry Brooks
Higgy21
Wow - I hate Crosby. Great game, Great tourney. BTW how the hell can we get Patrick Kane in a Blueshirt? I was most impressed by this guy. Also. Suter and Rafalski logged mad minutes today.
DCIGolfer
TOP= Don't even try and go there.. the game was well officated .. 2 pp each.. they let them play.. no controversy at all
sjw
Rhet: And watch Glen Sather pull some stupid rent a vet moves...DOH!
RF4L
not to start anything here, but both refs were canadians ;)
toporovski
my worst case scenario came through...crybaby scoring in ot...buttman prob pissed himself...
toporovski
I only saw the 3rd period [ work ] and what I saw was great fast paced hockey. And for me it was a win-win game, Canada won, and Uncle Daddy's fat ass was on the bench. Miller was outstanding all tourney long, Cally played like Cally always does, Kessler really impressed me, and in hindsight for us, Thorton out and Jeff Carter in, I heard the RCMP is actually looking for Thorton as he has been disapearing all tourney long, much like the P.Os. You should be proud of your boys Yanks, it does not get any closer
HamiltonHellhound
Crosby plays a lousy game overall and actually makes a mess of a clear cut breakaway that would have broken the US's backs if he'd scored. Then comes through when it counts - the sign of a true winner. Excellent game overall - the US played extremely well and I honestly had no idea 1 way or the other going into the OT period. Whew!!!
RF4L
TEAM USA played a heck of a game, I really thought they would crack when we got up 2-0.. it was an outstanding final.. decided on the ice.. and not in some stupid SO
sjw
Congrats to CANADA on winning the Gold!!! TEAM USA, you guys were F-ing awesome!!! RYAN MILLER MVP... Amazing Game... now we get to watch Bettman take all the Hockey momentum gained from the OLYMPICS and totally throw it away.
Rhet0ric
Way to GOLD Horseteeth
HamiltonHellhound
I don't blame Miller for that loss, but Rafalski just leaving his assignment to skate in unmolested on Miller.
York18
God, That hurt. I would have prefered to have not even won a medal than lose to Canada. The good thing is if the NHL decides to send a team next Olympices we have a strong young team and will only be better next time.
York18
At least FATSO wasn't the Canadian hero, eh?
NYStranger
The GOLD is home.. like no other country in the world, hockey is part of the National soul ....even if it's Criesbaby scoring
sjw
...the pain
NYStranger
That stinking puke... Lord how I hate the BASTARD.
Tucc
Of all the rumdum's, it had to be Cindy.
GangGreen
another reason to hate Hugh Jessimen 8^P
NYStranger
Another reason for me to hate Parise !!!
HamiltonHellhound
I'll take Johnathan Quail Higgins before Christopher Higgins!
NYStranger
Start by pounding Sindy Crybaby as hard and often as possible.
Tucc
GO TEAM USA!!!!!!!
NV94
Just a few hours til gametime. I am actually going to have to tape the game and watch it from the beginning in the afternoon. In analyzing the game here is what I see. The Canadian team can play a skilled game or a North/South game. The Russians made the mistake of trying to play a more North/South game against Canada. You aren't going to out North/South the Canadian or American teams if you are the Russians, Fins, Slovaks, etc. In fact, the US team is the best North/South team in this tournament but concedes a lot on the talent side to Canada. To win today I believe the US needs to play a relentlessly aggressive North/South game. They need to use their speed to swarm the Canadian D on the forecheck. They need to keep Canada pinned in their own end under relentless physical attack. If I am WILSON I am targeting PRONGER specifically, and one or two other Canadian D that aren't quick enough to handle the pressure. I am also trying to get PRONGER and BOYLE to lose their cool and hurt their team. You can't sit back against the Canadian team and let them play their game.
Vic
Its important games that are coming up now. A lot of teams will come flying out of the gate... We need to string together a couple of wins. I think it will be really hard to get up over the line.
Ola
F Crosby, F Fatty, F Joe "No Big Game" Thorton, and F the best athletes in Canada who all go play hockey. If you are a multi sport superstar in any High School U.S.A and are a good winger on your HS hockey team but can throw a 95 mph fastball, I wonder what sport you are picking. Go USA GO...score first...I will strut with my 96 worldcup jersey at the Sather Rally then give Miller a Standing O!!!!!!!!!!!
shonuff
RF73 than he would be close to some of the top NYR ..... ;-)
stevielegs
Higgy21---Christopher Higgins 2009-10 Calgary NHL GP 6; G 0; A 0; PTS 0; +/- 0; PIM 0; Shots 21; Pct 0.00%...Yeah, I guess he's just warming up, on pace to finish a big fat ZERO!
RF73
Also congrats to JOKINEN for winning the bronze medal. He played a strong game despite being on a line with Jerkko Ruutu. GABORIK played a good game even though he's not 100% healthy. I don't know about the HOSSA brothers. Lots of talent, but something is missing. Marian didn't rise to the occasion yesterday after having a strong showing thus far. And Marcel is among the league leaders in KHL but doesn't do a thing in the Olympics?
NYRinMN
Today's game is hyped up here in Minnesota as quite a few players are from this state and/or played in the area schools and universities. There's a home and garden show at the city convention center and they want people to still go since the game will be televised at the show so no one has to miss it. I would be happier if local news stopped over-hyping Lindsay Vonn though. I don't give a rats ass that her husband is 9 years older and she is estranged from her dad, blah blah blah!
NYRinMN
Time for Sather to bring back Christopher Higgins, who used to be our best player..
Higgy21
Working days today so will miss most of the game, even though I still firmly believe pros should not be at the Olympics, this has truly been great hockey to watch. I hope Cally has a great game and stays healthy, I hope Dreary plays well enough to raise his level for other NHL teams to see whatever Sather 1st saw and it gets his ass traded out of NYC, and most importantly, GO CANADA GO
HamiltonHellhound
Is the game tonight hyped any in the US?
Ola
Ret- That Pittsburgh source is usually pretty good. Kaberle have one of the best contracts in the game. And I wonder if he isn't the best D in the game also, but he have been caught on a hopeless team in Toronto forever. BUT, he is a left shooting offensiveminded D. In other words, he and MDZ can't be on the ice at the same time, basically. He is 31, a tad to old to fit in well for us. He is a D, something we need, but not as much as help up front.
Ola
RF4L: 'hoping Sidney Crosby scores the winning goal!' Ahhh the pain!! ;-) should be a great game. GO USA!!!
NYStranger
Inside Pittsburgh Sports.com reported that LEAFS defenseman Tomas Kaberle was willing to waive his NTC to come to the NY Rangers... the Leafs reportedly are interested in CALLY... who isn't? ...I'd like to see if we could get the Leafs interested in REDDEN again:)
Rhet0ric
Higgy... what is your source? It does sound like the type of trade that LA would make... I think Rozi could turn it around in Minnesota... plus, he is only owed $7 MIL over the next 2 years... which is actually a more reasonable salary for him than his cap hit is... VIC... If true, this deal is about two things... 1-Bringing in a player for SATHER to make his push for the playoffs and MOST IMPORTANTLY... 2-For the Rangers to clear out cap space... not only do we get rid of Rozi, but FROLOV is a UFA... as an added bonus, we clear a roster spot for a young D to be promoted... but if the deal is true, it definitely seems like there will be another one coming...
Rhet0ric
BOB... I have to disagree... If we were going to lose to anyone, I'm glad it's Canada... I always root for them(when they're not playing us:) ...I also have to say that the Canadian poeple have been awesome hosts... a total class act... they have also been rooting for the American athlete's every chance they get... CHEERS!!!
Rhet0ric
NO to FROLOV! That is not a player that is going to make this team significantly better. If we are going to send SANGS and 2nd somewhere it has to be a for a younger playmaking center.
Vic
Bob: Once again, thanks for the kind words. For me, they are totally reciprocated. I have worked in the US since 2000 many times, especially from 06 to 08 and guess what? When you get to know each other, we are very much the same - same ideals, same political views, same family values, same everything. Of course, there are variations when it comes to the extremes, but who the hell cares? Not me. And I have found that the biggest difference is that Americans are vocally patriotic - Canadians, I maintain, are equally passionate but not so vocally. Neither is right nor wrong, but the former attracts more attention. What some loudmouth Canadians fail to realize is that we have universal health care instead of a strong military. We don't need to - we live next door to you! All that said...Go Canada Go...and that includes hoping Sidney Crosby scores the winning goal! ;-)
RF4L
Rozival and Sangs would go to Minnesota. Kings get Rangers 2nd round pick and Zidlicky. Rangers get Frolov.
Higgy21
RF4L, SJW, HH.......right now on NBC on the west coast, they are showing a story on Gander folks taking care of all the stranded air passengers after 9/11, demonstrating again why I admire the people of Canada. What an amazing, heartfelt effort these people made. This has been my experience every time I have visited Canada. Been to a lot of other countries to.....none of them are like Canada. Its why I almost wish tomorrows game was not USA-CAN. I am conflicted. Luckily, Crosby and the Flyers on your team help tilt the balance for me.
Bob
Higgy: where did that come from? what's going the other way? 3 team trade?
mf
Alexander Frolov supposedly headed to NYR
Higgy21
NHL Trade Rumors Roundup.... Fourth Period.com is reporting a rumor that has VOKOUN being dealt to the CAPITALS for Jose Theodore and either John Carlson or Marcus Johnsson and a pick... the TORONTO SUN is reporting more rumors that Brian Burke is looking to shake up the LEAFS being both a buyer and a seller at the deadline... Stephen Harris of the Boston Herald is reporting the BRUINS have interest in Ray Whitney, Teemu Selanne, Tomas Kaberle and Aaron Ward... Chris Vivlamore of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution reported that Slava Kozlov has asked to be traded, with the BRUINS, KINGS and DETROIT allegedly being interested... Bruce Garrioch of the Ottawa Sun reported that several teams have called the SENATORS about Shean Donovan... and Finally, from ECKLUND... the RANGERS supposedly have 2 deals in the works that could go down at midnight Sunday night.... one is with FLORIDA and the other is with LA...
Rhet0ric
We finally have an NHL goalie to back up Hank. Now we have to wait to see about Gaborik.
Bob
LOL... this is the correct link... http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=311736
Rhet0ric
BOB... AULD pickup is official... http://www.capgeek.com/contracts.php
Rhet0ric
MF...The Rangers having interest in AULD has been reported in other places as well, so there's probably some truth to it... his remaining salary for the rest of the year would be less than $200K, definitely worth the audition... now that GABBY is hurt, my biggest concern is that SATHER will make a dumb move to bring in a veteran in order to try to make the playoffs... Word out of Tampa is that the new owner should be allowed to take control this coming week(not sure if it's in time for the end of the trade deadline or not... there are all kind of rumors flying(as is the case when any new owner takes over) that he might clean house here(GM and Coach)... or that just the GM will get the axe... while LAWTON deserves it, TOCCHET does not... not only is LAWTON a sub-par GM, but he's done everything he can in the last few weeks to undermine his coach... but if TOCCHET did become available, I'd love to have him behind our bench... If the new owner does take over before the deadline, expect to hear the VINNIE to NYR rumors going around again(it's been rumored that he wants to get out from under Vinnie's contract)... KUDOS to the U.S. Women's Hockey Team, Silver is nothing to be ashamed of... a better site for FREE AGENTS, etc... http://www.capgeek.com/contracts.php
Rhet0ric
Text from Darren Dreger: Rangers claimed Alex Auld on re-entry.
Bob
Heres to a good final for the gold with the USA on top naturally....... So Gabby's hurt ay, could dictate the how the "big secret" aka Glennie boy, Slats for brains, plays his hand these last 5 days before the trade deadline.... personally, I dont want Gabby to be hurt, but if he sat out the rest of the season and we tanked, so be it.....Having the Olympics now seems advantageous from the point of view that it showcases the elites where they're thrown together and have to adjust to a new team setting.... Just another reference before we put a guy on our "wish list" when attempting to right this ship. ......................(free agent listing for next saeson).......... http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/freeagents.php?team=all&type=all&year=2010&pos=ALL
mf
Rangers could claim veteran goalie Auld ....... http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/rangers/rangers_could_claim_veteran_goalie_VeHWIWLlm5Wuk4g2IaMgcI
mf
So the NYR pay a guy 7.5, and he decides to play instead of rest his injury. Yet in the regular season, the team usually decides, except when the coach is in a desperate mood. . Just another reason to move these games to the summer. The last Olympics did a number on the NYR. Why shouldn't this one? .......
stevielegs
Rumor of Gabby groin injury, kept him out of 3rd period against Canada. Not good if remotely true.
puckyou
You guys up north exhale yet? Wow. Pavol Demitra deserves a thank you card from all of Canada for gakking on an empty net.
Bob
Congrats Canada my ASS!! We want the USA...you got 'em!!! Arogant bunch of pricks and Crosby is a reincarnation of Boob Clarke! A little PUKE!! Anyway...on to th eimportant stuff, what happened to Gaborik?
MelvilleFred
Holy Open Net Batman! DEMITRA is going to be seeing that open net in his dreams for the next 50 years. Congrats to Canada although it got waaaaay too close for comfort. The Slovaks made a good run at it and they did it without GABORIK. I hope GABBY didn't re-injure the leg. Hell, given his past it could be anything but I would bet it was pretty bad to keep him out of the 3rd period. You could tell something wasn't right with him from the start. He didn't have the jump that you usually see from him.
Vic
Anyone know what's up with Gaborik?
jkropp
Holy crap! I've never been so happy to be wrong before. The US was flying in that first period and then put it in coast pretty much for the rest of the game. I was worried during the first shift or two because the Fins were looking really good and the US couldn't get it out or get control. And then it happened.......what a costly mikstake by KIPR. After that the US just flipped the switch and swarmed them. I do have to say that after I bagged on STASTNY earlier in the week he has played much better the last 2 games. KANE also looks like he is gaining his confidence. Hopefully they can give Canada a good game on Sunday.
Vic
6-1 final. Wonder who the USA will face on Sunday................
Bob
Wow. 6-0 USA!
Bob
Actually, it's funny you mentioned it...I went to the place where I normally buy my hockey sticks today and noticed a gigantic window-sized Crosby poster hanging in the front as I pulled in...the one with the friggin' powder blue jersey and Sid's big 'ol horse-head teeth showing...Turns out, they didn't have my stick(Easton SE6...don't know why I like it, but it's the only composite I've liked so far)...I probably would have tried a different label...but with that goddamn Crosby poster still fresh in my head, I just stormed out in disgust...went to a different store...which ironically had a Matteau-Ranger jersey hanging in the window...bought a stick there...SUCK IT CROSBY ;)
tdchi
TD... You are looking at JAGR through rose colored beer glasses... he had the prima donna thing going on here in NY, he just stopped doing the whole sulking act... he also wanted to be surrounded by his guys (just like Messier)... his leaving was almost identical to the way Messier left... If the GM whole hartedly wanted to keep him, he could've bent over backwards to do it, but didn't... if the player wanted to stay bad enough, he could've taken less money to stay here and didn't... I guess it comes down to who you were a bigger fan of... Anyway, NO to Jagr or any player we've had in the past... we need to move forward... JMO... CROSBY... He works the refs like any superstar does, but he becomes annoying because he whines when he doesn't get his way... that being said, I wouldn't mind having him on my team:) ...According to the TORONTO SUN... GM Brian Burke has said that the LEAFS will both be buyers and sellers at the trade deadline... they will be willing to take on payroll if picks/prospects were involved in the return... anyone interested in sending REDDEN and our 2nd Pick for KOMISAREK?
Rhet0ric
LOL! TD, that post wasn't really directed at you in particular but I see it hit you right between the eyes! I think I'm going to have to send you a CROSBY Fathead for Christmas next year. How about this one (http://www.fathead.com/nhl/pittsburgh-penguins/sidney-crosby-stanley-cup/)??? Look! It happens to be a "Top Gift" at Fathead. You can put it in your family room, or wherever you watch TV. Better yet, you could put it over your bed!
Vic
BTW - I don't like football and could care less about baseball suck, so Jeter, Manning, Brady and all their counterparts can suck it, for all I care.
tdchi
Vic- Did you read ANY of my post?!? Because if you did, you OBVIOUSLY didn't comprehend it. I have a million reasons to dislike CROSBY, and granted, some of them have to do with the media hype he so clearly embraces. But many of them have to do with how he carries himself on the ice. You say Messier and Gretzky were just as bad?!? BULL SHIT. He's the biggest whiner I've seen in this league. It's diminished over time, but then again, no one can get near him anymore. I'd love to say that was solely because of his talent, but it's not. Guys know if they get near that little bitch, he'll dive or cry or whine until the stripes call it...I'll give another example of his BS...The last Pittsburgh game...he was SWATTING Dubinsky's stick...and Dubinsky...basically needling him at the faceoff. And he didn't think anything of it in a close game. Why? Because he know he's not going to get called for it. The league loves him, and they protect him like he's still 18. You want to be blind and say they don't, fine...You want to lust after this POS...fine... But don't get on my ass for calling a spade a spade...BTW...I was among the few(rather one of the ONLY Ranger fans) that said how long do we need to payback Messier for the cup win...And for the record, I've NEVER forgiven Captain ME for blowing off the Rangers back in 1997, when they could have conceivably won another cup. I thought the way he bowed out of NY was about as graceful as a highspeed trainwreck and fault HIM for prompting some of the worst trades in Ranger history(See: Zubov, Nedved I, Norstrom, Weight). I haven't liked Messier since he left, and will never see him as the hero many NYR fans do.
tdchi
If Canada plays like they did against the Germans and Russians, I honestly cannot see how they can lose. However, as we all know, anything can happen in a single game series, which is what both of these games are. I just glad Brodeur isn't playing - I recognize this guy's talent (albeit at 37, eroding talent to be more precise) but I really don't like his attitude. He's as arrogant as OV, but expresses via pointing blame elsewhere, which IMO is worse than OV simply shooting his big mouth off.
RF4L
RF4L---They should enjoy themselves. they came through in the biggest game. Congrats to them. I expect the same thing from the Canada men's team. If it is against the USA, I will have to root against them but if they apply themselves, i don't see how they can possible lose.
Bob
Bob: It is pretty funny - I think the problem is that here in politically correct Canada, at least one girl is 18 (the girl who scored both goals yesterday for example) and the drinking age in this country is 19. If that's all it is and no 18 year old ended up in the hospital, it's much ado about nothing IMO. In fact, leave them alone - they were harming no one.
RF4L
BOB: Yep, TKACHUK and ROENICK were both immature embarrassments for the USA. I remember when ROENICK first came into the league. He was a super talented kid who could have been a CROSBY type player. I just don't think he ever had the head for it. He was lazy and immature. He never reached the potential that he had. There are a long line of guys who could have been great "generational" type players but weren't for one reason or another. AK27 could have been a monster like AO but he didn't have it between the ears. That is why I don't hate the guys who do achieve that level of ability and results. There are so few who are born with the god given ability to be that talented. There are fewer still who have what it takes between the ears.....
Vic
LOL at the Canada ladies partying with booze and cigars on the ice after their win. Don't see a problem with it.....they ar Canadian, right? Who would expect anything else? At least they didn't trask the olympic village like Keith Tkachuk and friends.
Bob
Again, most of the complaints about CROSBY have nothing to do with him. You are bitching and moaning about the media. Did you hate MESSIER? Did you hate GRETZKY? They were overblown and ass-kissed to death by the media and still are. For Christ's sake MESSIER can take a piss on the side of a building and the only thing the media would say is that he showed great leadership in the way he did it. Do you hate DEREK JETER? Do you hate PEYTON MANNING or TOM BRADY? Did you hate LAWRENCE TAYLOR? Is your definition of hate simply that you hate any star who happens to play for a different team but you love them when they play for your team? That is pretty weak IMHO. My feelings about CROSBY are the same as my feelings toward PARISE, RICHARDS, MALKIN, TAVERAS, etc. They play for division rival teams and I wish they fail completely but I don't hate them. I would love to have any of them on the Rangers. Now, my feelings toward BRASHERE were different. He was a scumbag cheapshot prick who I had no desire to ever see in a Ranger uniform. Thanks GLENN....
Vic
most are prima donnas ................
stevielegs
should read: Jagrs return to form....need more coffee!!!
NYStranger
Can't we just agree that ANYTHING associated with the Pittsburgh Penguins sucks ass! I for one STILL have no love for Jagr and he can go rot in Russia for all time. His play and the way he handled himself in NY (until his last season) quelled my hatred somewhat but I never thought he was the answer and his return to for hurt us in the long run. This guy is not championship leader material. On Sid the kid: I would cry like Crosby if he ever became a Ranger. He is a POS. And if Lemieux didn't have his nose so far up Buttman's ass that they could have knitted their nose hairs together the Penguins WOULD have moved or folded. LOL
NYStranger
And for the record, it would be great if either player was a New York Ranger, IMO.
RF4L
Hospo: OV is not a whiny punk - he's an arrogant blowhard. The differences are obvious but in the end, the result the same. Tediousness. Interestingly enough, Crosby's whininess isn't as prominent as it was even last year, but OV's arrogance is growing. I suspect, however, his tail is between his legs and it will interesting to see if he tones down his verbiage when the NHL renews next week.
RF4L
RF4L - yep, Crosby is a suck..and a douche..and, you name it...Every second I watch his whining over-hyped ass on the ice, i want to see him laid out on the ice in a crumpled heap...OTOH, he is a GREAT player....But such a whiny punk compared o Ovechkin, although Canadian homers will disagree.....As for Jagr, yeah, he pulled some crap in Wshington, but lets not forget that the coach (Cassisdy) was an utter moron who was in so far over his head and who had no clue how to handle NHL players, let alone star players, and coach an NHL team....he needed to be fired..Doesn't excuse Jagr for telling the coach to fuck off when he wanted him to play that one game..,,,,,,ANd, hey, I'm sure Crosby will get there in a few years.....Rooting for Finland and SLovakia..Kinda had my fill of the arrogant US and Canadian teams, players, fans and media
Hospo
Crosby has not been dominant in the Olympics, but he has some great stretches of play. Clearly, however, he's played way better than that blowhard OV who hopefully, has learned something from his very non-Olympian effort. OV without a doubt is a great player and arguably the best in the game today, but his arrogance can sometimes get in the way of his effectiveness.
RF4L
JJ matured in Washington? By maturity you mean sulking, faking injuries because he didn't want to play with a mediocre team, to point where he pulled himself out of games, refusing to listen to the coach, in fact defying him on the bench and ultimately getting him fired, all the while merrily collecting his $11,000,000 paycheque? And Crosby's a suck? LOL!
RF4L
tdchi - come live in Pgh with me and you will truely despise him more.
Tikkanen
Vic - as the leader here of the I Loathe Crosbys, allow me to clarify: This is a kid that was pretty much handed the keys to the NHL on a silver platter. True, a lot of what I hate about Crosby has to do with the marketing and the fact that someone always wants to call him the next Gretzky...The fact is he's NOT Gretzky. He's not even close to Gretzky. Hell, he's not even the top player in the league, nor will he ever be. Instead, he's a poster child for ENTITLEMENT. No one here would argue that he did and STILL DOES get preferential treatment from the refs. They took care of 'Sid the Kid' when he came in...maybe it was because he was so young...well, he's not so young now...on the diving...when your as good as people SAY Crosby is, that's something you don't need to do!...and not to dig up dirty laundry or anything, but I have a tough time respecting a guy who A. punches another player in the balls while that guy is in a full-nelson and unable to defend himself(he never got a third-man-in penalty on that play either). B. Drops the gloves in the faceoff circle on a guy who doesn't fight and then pulls that players jersey over his head and tees off. C. Whines to the refs EVERY TIME a player plays him hard...Sorry, this guy is a pansy and needs his clock cleaned...But on that note...what do you think would have happened had a guy like CARCILLO pounded on Crosby? What do you think the league response to THAT would have been? Do you think it would just be a fighting major? No way. Danny Boy would be in the NHL brig.....Back to the media machine..I'll point out that the Penguins have NEVER had a winning season without Malkin in the lineup. Can't say the same about Crosby...Basically, I have NO reason to admire Crosby, and a mounting list of reasons to utterly despise him...I will note, however, I felt somewhat the same about JAGR...I was no fan of his in Pittsburgh and exhaled a sigh of relief when he went to Washington instead of NY...but they guy matured, and when he finally did come to NY, he was a class-act from the start(even when he came, I didn't like him much)...so maybe my Sid-hate will diminish with time...maybe its best to just see the POS achieve everything early, so it gets old with the media by the next Olympics...Then again, it would feel SO good to watch this jerk-off fail for once...the IOC doesn't seem too interested in giving him his medal, like the NHL did with his cup.
tdchi
I don't think anybody denies Crosby's talent, but I totally despise and loathe him. Call me jealous, but the guy is CONSTANTLY shoved down our throats. I get it worse because I live in Pittsburgh, but every nationally televised game consists of the Pens vs. (insert opponent). They blow sunshine up his ass constantly on TV. While his antics on the ice are not as bad as his rookie year, he stills yaps and whines to the refs after almost every whistle. He talks SO much crap on the ice but only when he is on the bench and between the refs. I know lots of players yap and talk, but he does it and his only retaliation is sucker punching a guy in the balls or jumping a guy off the face-off. He cries about the way Ovechkin celebrates, he cries about hats being thrown on the ice for a hat trick...etc. He is Bettman's poster boy and as long as it is that way, he and the Pens will get more breaks than they deserve. Most know the Pens should have been a team that folded and left town 5 years ago, but for the 'luck' of the draft.
Tikkanen
TD: AO was putrid in the Olympics. He treated it like an All-Star game. He only concerned himself with trying to score. His play was, on the whole, selfish. He never played a team game especially in their final game against Canada. He was directly responsible for at least two goals because he couldn't be bothered to backcheck or put out any kind of an effort in the defensive end. I really like him as a player but was disappointed with his play in the Olympics. He is a much more complete player then he showed here.
Vic
As for MARTY, I can honestly say that I never liked him. I never hated him either. I'd call it a mild dislike that mostly stems from the fact that I believe he has been vastly overrated his entire career. His stats and accomplishments have been greatly enhanced because of the team he has played on. I don't think he is deserving of being mentioned in the same sentence as some of the great goaltenders of all time and it irritates me when I hear people like EMERICK use the tag line of "perhaps the greatest goaltender in NHL history" when they talk about him.
Vic
Bob - haha...maybe the IOC should do the sex-text on Crosby...that COULD explain a lot...sjw - yeah, I was thinking the same thing. TOEWS and NASH have been outstanding for the Canadians, why just about the only visible thing the Crier has done has been yapping at the stripes...I just know, though, the media AIN'T going to give credit where credit is due...Just like with Russia...OV played alright...nothing stupendous though...He has one good hit on Jagr and suddenly he's the darling of the Olympics...Roenick's asking him if he wants to come over for an evening cocktail...blah blah blah....And you know if Canada wins, THE FIRST guy they're going to pull aside is Crosby. 'Sid, you are just so super wonderful and you've achieved everything in hockey at the ripe young age of 22, tell us: Is there any other way we can kiss your ass? Can we rename hockey to Crosby?'...I can't take it. My TV can't take it...My loathing for Crosby knows no bounds...For the first time in a decade, I clipped off the TV so that I wouldn't need to see that little shit touch the cup...yet I now need to watch highlights of it EVERY TIME HE TAKES TO THE ICE. I don't think I could take footage of that and Crosby biting a gold in the same calendar year. The hockey gods must have some sort of mercy on me here.
tdchi
I still don't get the CROSBY hate fest. I don't think he has played poorly in the Olympics and I just don't understand why some folks here, and elsewhere, hate him with the intensity that they seem to. If you hate the hype machine that has been surrounding him since he was a kid that is one thing but he really has nothing to do with that. The NHL has been searching for an heir to GRETZKY for years and their marketing machine (as puny as it is) has been pushing CROSBY as that heir since before he was drafted. If you recall, the same hype machine was in effect for SPEZZA when he was just a kid. SPEZZA never lived up to that expectation but he is still a great talent. When the NHL saw that SPEZZA wasn't going to be what they hoped they hopped onto CROSBY's bandwagon. Again, he doesn't really have much to do with that entire song and dance routine. He is just a hockey player and a great one at that. Does he talk a lot to the Refs on the ice? Yep, he does. So did MESSIER, GRETZKY and just about every other star player. Does he dive from time to time? Yep, he does take the occasional dive and embellish the impact of a hook or stick check. SO WHAT. A LOT OF PLAYERS DO IT and it is a smart tactic if you can get away with it. Maybe I'm missing something. Maybe CROSBY does stuff away from the ice that I don't know about. Does he torture puppies? Does he push old ladies over and steal their purses?
Vic
I detest Criesbaby and Martina.....and both have sucked... Martina is ridin the pine, replace by Luongo and Criesbaby has been out played up front by everyone except Thornton , who also has underperformed.. Toews has been outstanding.
sjw
Well, the US had to let Canada win one hockey gold, right? ;)
Bob
they looked like men.....and cindy looks like and acts like a girl......
stevielegs
On a side note, if it weren't for Crosby or fat ol' Uncle D., I probably wouldn't care...at least about them winning the gold...unless it was at the humiliation of the US...But I can't think of a more fitting send off for Marty and a better inaugural Olympics for crier than to watch their bulbous crocodile tears as they await a Canadian lynch mob after a loss.
tdchi
sjw - The one place the gold DOESN'T belong is around the neck of that horse-toothed, siliver spoon-sucking crybaby Gretzky-Lemieux wannabe CROSBY. I'd honestly rather watch the death of hockey than hear ANOTHER stinking POS announcer gleefully say something like 'Crosby, last year the youngest-ever captain to win a Stanley Cup, now has a gold medal...AND in his first Olympics to boot!!' Sorry, but the gold belongs ANYWHERE but Canada with that whining scumbag on the team...I'd love a US win and do the happy dance for the rest of 2010 if it happens. But if not, please...PLEASE...will one of Finland or Slovakia rise to the challenge...Enjoy your women's gold, hossers...'cause I've got every ounce of my hope banked on you losing the men's title!!
tdchi
USA wins tomorrow and finshes canada in the final.
NV94
Canada 2 USA 0 .... Woman's hockey Gold is ours... with the mens team watching ....time to step up and bring the men's gold home... where it belongs .....
sjw
Don't follow a Tomato Man. Ketchup.
FerociousMonk
Jim.Screw the pick next Brendl,Jessiman lol lets make a playoffs lol
ilya
I too like the no touch icing, one day someone will die on the ice becuase of the foot race for the puck
HamiltonHellhound
Bob: It's probably got more to do with the pressure thing than anything else. Canada is ALWAYS expected to win, no matter what the tourney but those expectations have been cranked up tenfold because 1) it's the Olympics 2) Canada didn't even medal in the last Olympics 3) it's on Canadian soil. That pressure comes from the Canadian people of course, but the players want to win as much as the fans do, if not moreso. I'm not excusing what Boyle did, just rationalizing.
RF4L
RF4L--I find fascinating that you see a different side of some of these players when they play for their country. Alot of it is pride, of course which is admirable. But that seemed out of character for Boyle. A few of the other Canadian players have been chippy to dirty in these games. Perhaps it is due to the enourmous pressure to win that they are under. Perhaps it is because the NHL is not running things, and they can get away with more, I don't know. I do know that I like the no-touch icing, I like the no commercial breaks (or the 10 second ones), and the speed and hitting has been great. I hope we see a USA-CAN final because the USA will be guaranteed a silver. I think Canada wins.....and they should. they have the best players. Of course, if one of them runs and injured Gaborik, I will be pissed.
Bob
RF4L - He was penalized. But some of us here think he should be OUT of the games altogether. Canada certainly beat the piss out of the Ruskies. Outclassed though? Not after that Boyle hit...Another thing...anyone hear about CROSBY's handshake the other day? Blew his nose into his hand before the lineup...I WANT CANADA TO LOSE SOOOOO BADLY. No offense to my brethren to the north, but I hate that team...From Uncle Daddy down to that piece of shit Crysby...the only medal he deserves is on the tip of a boot shoved up his ass.
tdchi
TD: I hope you are right. We shall see....
Vic
Bob: Being a punk...he should have been penalized. That particular incident, however, had zero bearing on the game's outcome. The Canucks throttled the Russians and basically outclassed them in every aspect of the game, including coaching. The Russian coach was horrible. He left Nabakov in too long, he left the OV, Semin and Malkin line together too long and even though he had the last change, he didn't bother trying to avoid the Toews/Richards/Nash line, a line that shut down OV and his bigmouth all game long and even chipped in with a very nice goal. Good thing for that coach it's not circa 1970 or he'd be facing the gulag!
RF4L
Soon the NHL will start anew - here's hoping the Rangers finish in the bottom 2 so Sather can't screw up drafting a bluechipper!
RF4L
RF4L--care to explain what the hell Dan Boyle was doing in a game that was already decided. His comment after the game was "that's hockey." What would have happened if one of the Russians did that to Sid or Getzlaf?
Bob
Roenick could at least get his teeth fixed if he wants to be on TV. He looks and sounds like a dork. I don't really care for Olczyk either. Miss the days of Davidson as the analyst. ... Thank God for Emrick.
Zebop
Vic- I've got to disagree. I have good faith that the US will make the gold medal round, and if there's a team that WILL beat Canada, it's them. So far, there have been three keys to winning in the Olympics in this order: scoring, goaltending and defense. The latter two have been the REAL difference makers, IMO...For instance, the Swiss wouldn't have even made the quarterfinals without HILLER in net. And the Russians wouldn't have had such dismal showing against Canada(and Slovakia) had they had a blue line to speak of. I look at the names on Slovakia and Finland's blueline, and I'm very unimpressed. They both have a solid anchor(PITKANEN and CHARA respectively), but lack much depth after that...I look at USA...that's a hell of a blueline...and a well-balanced one too. I'm not going to go as far as to say they're going to win it all, but I think they will end up with one of the two top medals...Dany – I don't know how either of those clowns have a job. When I was watching that piece about OV last night, I though ROENICK was going plant a wet one on his kisser and then give him a reach around. Hated JR when he was an NHLer. Hated Team USA when he was a member. And now I can't stand him as an announcer...on a side note, I've noticed that EVERY prediction Roenick and Milbury make seems to be wrong. Hockey's two biggest douche bags can't call the sky blue. Surprise, surprise.
tdchi
Anyone else catch that when Roenick was talking with Milbury and what's his face he said he would take Crosby over Ovis hands down and then in his interview with Ovie he told him he was the best player in the world...
DanyloHalytskyj
Ok. Now that we are down to 4 teams here are my predictions as to how this ends. GOLD-Canada, SILVER-Finland, Bronze-USA. I would love to see a rematch between Canada and the US in the finals but I don't think it is going to happen. I think the US team's luck is about running out. I hope not but I just get this feeling that they are going to lose tomorrow. Even if they did make it to the finals I think they get rolled by Canada.
Vic
Also, there's rumours that the Russian team had some internal issues and apparently Radulov was one of the main culprits with regards to bitching about icetime. Let him stay in the KHL where he belongs!
RF4L
BTW, Canada's thrashing of the Russians was for me particularly sweet due to OV's big mouth and his spouting off to the press about how wonderful it will be for him WHEN the Russians beat Canada in Canada and how the Caps 15 game win streak will be nothing compared to the feeling of beating Canada in Canada. Where's his big words now?? LOL! Looks good on the prima-donna (and that's what he's become, too).
RF4L
td - I forgot to add my smiley face to indicate the sarcasm with Radulov covering the future considerations in the Jessiman deal. That would be like Beukeboom for Shaw being the future considerations in the Messier deal. Who was Edmonton's GM at the time of that trade? : )
DREW
Vic - Totally agree about the RUSSIANS. Every time they hit the ice, they looked like six players skating in different directions. This was NOT the Russians of years past...Ditto on the SEMIN hit. There was absolutely nothing wrong with it. BOYLE, on the other hand...I doubt the committee will bench him for even a game, but he sure as shit deserves it. In the NHL, he would have gotten his clock cleaned for a maneuver like that...Canada DID outplay the Russians, but something I quickly noticed was that there was NO defense in front of NABOKOV. Zippo...Zilch...I guess that's what happens when KALININ is one of your top defenders...I also agree that game could have EASILY gone the other direction, had they simply put BRYZ in net for the second. Another real piss-poor coaching decision in these games...That's almost as bad as Babcock starting Uncle Daddy against the Yanks, but not quite. BABCOCK aught to thank his lucky stars that his team went up against the Russians on a night when they were clearly out of their element...his bad decision against the US brought them perilously close to being one of the biggest embarrassments of the games...I STILL don't think it's going to be a cake walk for CANADA...they have a knack for lighting up against teams with no defense so far, but have found themselves against the wall when playing two defensively sound teams(Swiss and Canada)...RF4L - PLEASE don't bring up the drafting argument again...for the sanity of all of us here...But on my comment about the KHLers, I don't seriously believe the Rangers or any NHL team will go after any of them. But to see some of those guys fire it up at such a high level of competition, it really gets me wondering...DREW - I think you're right: The Preds do own Radulov's rights still...there was a blog post about it yesterday, where the Preds GM wasn't ruling out that he'd return in time for the playoffs...But by return, he meant Rads would be in a Pred uniform...no doubt, his rights wouldn't be worth full-value...but future considerations? No way. Nashville wouldn't do us that favor, even though JESSIMAN has become a prolific scorer...um...sort of...um...in a 15-goals-in-50 games sort of way...Ola - no offense, but I'm tickled that SWEDEN is out of the dance...That means we get a RESTED Hank next week! The haul is going to be a bit tougher for Buffalo, Montreal and Calgary.
tdchi
Bob- No, I don't think anyone who saw the game can argue that. First goal is a pass across the entire zone and a one-time slapper by Gabby. Hanks stick was also broken so he played with a D's stick in that situation, but no matter what, its a extremely hard shot to stop. Second goal comes 35 second after that. Its a 2 on 1, Lidström is caught inbetween and Strbek gets a pass at the far post that he manage to elevate and Hank really have no chance on the play. On the 3rd goal, and the only goal that looked even remotely saveble, Demitra scores on a slapper from the far bords. But Hank have two guys right in his face, and you can clearly see how he doesn't see squat of the shot. Like he have a clear path, but right when the shot is taken Öhlund shows up to clear the crease. The 4th is another 2 on 1/3 on 2. A shot is taken, it hits the D's stick 3 feets infront of the net, but Lundqvist saves the shot, but Kopecky I think gets the rebound right at his stick and can just put it home.
Ola
Bob: Agreed on Doughty and Weber. The latter I kinda knew about because he played on 2 WJC teams for Canada around the same time as Staal, but Doughty I hadn't seen much, partially because he plays in LA. The stuff he's doing with the puck (and even without) at the tender age of 20 is mind-boggling. How good is he gonna be in 4 to 5 years? Second overall selection - who said bottoming out doesn't land you studs???
RF4L
from lb...'...with the exiled Steve Valiquette going the other way. Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/rangers/olympic_break_helps_banged_up_del_qXcCrjOlUiANuJvBbaNwYO#ixzz0gY5ZFR7Q .................it makes zero sense to have a kid as backup constantly going up and down. There's probably more to this story. Maybe Valli told Tortie where to go. Why no deal yet for a real backup? Another genius non-move of illogical ideas , that once led to over Dunham.
stevielegs
Hank gave up 4 on 14 shots? Yikes. Did he do an Uncle Daddy impression?
Bob
What odds do I get on Finland-Slovakia in the final? ;) Nah just kidding. I can't see what can stop Canada now, the US included. But, knowing international hockey, looking back at history, I wonder if odds still aren't pretty high that Finland or Slovakia will win. Anyway, the 4 nations left will carry the flag of hockey high for the rest of the tournament. Canada deserved beating the Russia. They have faced a insane amount of pressure, and they handled it. Finland and Slovakia want it so tremendously much. The USA have a great hockeyprogram that just is starting to pay off.
Ola
One other thing.....I couldn't disagree more with "Edzo" (the Black Ace in the broadcast booth). That hit by SEMIN was totally legal and not the least bit dirty. It wasn't late at all as BOYLE was still playing the puck. It was a shoulder to shoulder hit that sent BOYLE flying. What BOYLE did, on the other hand, was as bad and as dirty as anything I have seen in international competition in 35 years. BOYLE should be suspended for the rest of the Olympics.
Vic
Not a good showing by the US today but coming off that big win and playing a team they have already beaten I can't say that I didn't see it coming. I was hoping for a better game in the Canada/Russia contest but it wasn't to be. In addition to the bad goaltending and lazy play that others have already commented on I wanted to add that the defensive coverage of the Russian team was putrid. It reminded me of the Rangers. The other thing that struck me as I watched the game was that I didn't feel like I was really watching a Russian team. Maybe these guys have been so influenced by their time in the NHL that they don't play "Russian Hockey" any more. Sure, they still have the slick individual skating and stickhandling skills but they no longer play the puck possession game they used to. Those guys used to be so good you couldn't get the puck away from them. The North American teams would spend most of the game chasing their tails. Now, the Russian team spends most of its time trying home-run passes or trying to beat guys 1 on 1 (or 1 on 2). They don't move the puck and attack in unison any more. Congrats to the Canadian team as they came to play. I too like WEBER and DOUGHTY....but then again who wouldn't...;-).
Vic
RF4L---tonight showed why I still picked Canada for gold after the US loss. I am watching SWE-SVK and I don't see either of them handling Canada. Luongo has settled down the team. BTW, the 2 Canada players I have been most impressed with are Doughty and Weber. They are both studs. The two I am least impressed with are Pronger and Thornton. And, of course, Uncle Daddy!
Bob
And other then the boys winning big tonight, my personal hilite was Uncle-Daddy's fat ass stuck to the pine all night.
HamiltonHellhound
Not to take anything away from Canada, who just flat-out outplayed Russia, but they got some help by some lousy goaltending tonight and even more help from the Russian coach who should have pulled Nabakov after the 4th goal. You could tell he just didn't have it. Two goals later before he gets yanked and it was a sleeper. Sitting here watching the Latvia-Czech game and it is looking like goaltending is going to be at a premium for these Olympics. Voukon and Kipper are throwing down. It's pretty crazy... some really sick saves in just about every game. If you're goaltending is at all 'mortal', you are going to be watching the medal rounds.
Z
cnparda: I don't know about that one. Looks to me like the Canadians were riding a wave of emotion going in and Russia got some lousy goaltending all the way around. I think what showed me something was how quickly they can tack off goals. I would expect the Russians to come back a way more organized team. If Canada plays the way they did tonight then they are going to win gold. Awesome display.
E
OV and the Russians taken behind the woodshed and spanked good and hard by the Canadians. OV and the rest of the big guns were invisible.
RF4L
RF4L: Dunham is the goalie coach for the Islanders. Anybody else watching the Russians get outworked, outclassed and embarrassed by the Canadians? Doughty and Weber are amazing. I am probably the only one thankful Kova was not traded to the Rangers, great shot but not a complete player. He is way lazy, he doesn't backcheck and was just awful in that first period. Give me a Gabby, Alfredsson any day.
cnparda
A Devil is on his way to becomi8ng the new Captain America hockey version...Good job Sather u D..k. I cant wait for that rally next week.
shonuff
At the same time, it couldn't hurt to try. I mean, if you are a GM for another team -- and JJ signed a multi million dollar deal with the NYR and declared that he only will play for us -- would you gamble on picking him up of waivers? Do you get what I mean? Like what JJ do you get? Does he go there just to piss them off? What if he doesn't go there? They have to pay him, or terminate his contact. Then we can sign him again. Do they pay him just to keep him away from NY? I don't know. But it couldn't hurt to try.
Ola
USA / Switzerland live feed from NBC...http://www.nbcolympics.com/video/assetid=bf9c2f97-8b8c-463d-bc9d-9af4a7c92ebd.html#mens+quarterfinal+united+states+vs+switzerland
RF73
cnp: Where's Mike Dunham these days?
RF4L
Alex Auld on waivers from Dallas... Makes 1 mil, Rangers insert back-up goalie here.
cnparda
OMG, bring back JJ and Hossa? Where's Nylander when you need him? Pass the bong this way!!!
RF4L
tdchi - I love your posts...Regarding Radulov, doesn't Nashville still owe us future considerations for the Hugh Jessiman trade?
DREW
I found this in an blog entry about the JAGR-Edmonton situation, and it looks somewhat official...Can't vouch for authenticity though:"...In the event a professional or former professional Player plays in a league outside North America after the start of the NHL Regular Season, other than on Loan from his Club, he may thereafter play in the NHL during that Playing Season (including Playoffs) only if he has first either cleared or been obtained via Waivers. For the balance of the Playing Season, any such Player who has been obtained via Waivers may be Traded or Loaned only after again clearing Waivers or through Waiver claim...." So it sounds as though JJ WOULD need to go through waivers to be picked up, but WOULDN'T need to be signed by the trade deadline...now it appears as thought the KHL has three games left in its 56-game season...Jagr's OMSK is among the top teams, so he'll be tied up for the Russian POs. My guess is they'll be wrapped up in mid-March, unless the Russians like to drag things out for as long as the NHL...ANYWAY...if JJ were to be signed and went through waivers, the Rangers would get a crack at him after EDM, CAR, TOR, NYI, FLA, CBJ and ATL in that order...It's entirely conceivable that none of those teams would want Jagr, with exception to possibly the Panthers...Now...Picking up the bong and strapping on my Sather skin suit(unfortunately not authentic), I would market ROZSIVAL to the nearest taker...If he can't be moved, I'd send REDDEN to the minors, with a note saying maybe, just maybe, you'll be back up here for the POs if you show an ounce of passion for the game...With the money freed up, I'd sign JJ to a deal for the remainder of the season...Promote HEIKINNEN to replace Redden and keep Potter as a seventh defender...Actually, there are a number of guys who are looking REAL good in the Olympics...One guy I'd seriously take a look at is PATRICK THORENSEN. He's lighting it up in the KHL(51 points) and has been really the one bright spot of Norway..fast, hard-working player. Reminds me a little bit of Callahan...I know this one will stir some chuckles...but Marcel HOSSA has strung together another great season in the K. He's leading it in goals and..more tellingly...SHOTS. Why do I say this? Well, that was one of his big problems in NY. He'd dig for the puck, play a possession good game, but NEVER shoot...and then there's the CROWN JEWEL of the KHL: RADULOV. That guy has REALLY taken it up a notch in the KHL. Actually, I'd say he's looking better right now than MALKIN...then again, I have no idea what his status is with the NHL and Nashville. But I would make him my TOP priority in the offseason. Give whatever it takes to get that guy back in the league and in a Ranger jersey.
tdchi
Vic- Don't remind me... :( I probably can't watch Canada-Rus tonight, its 1.30 AM over here, and I have a ton of things I must take care of... Then Swedens game starts 6 am, and I can't watch that without finding out the results. Fuk.
Ola
Morning All. Well, today may be one of the best days to watch hockey in a generation. There are some great games today with every one of the medal hopefuls in action. The best game of the day promises to be the Canada/Russia game but the other three should be good as well. Hopefully the lest interesting to watch will be the USA game. I don't want to see a horrific upset. Enjoy the day and get your TIVO/DVR ready!
Vic
I thought the rule for signing someone to the playoffs was as long as they were signed prior to the trading deadline?
DREW
Anyone know what the thing was with JJ and EDM? According to JJ he would have signed with them last season if Omsk had missed the PO's. They secured a PO spot in the last game of the reg season. There is something about it, contract or something.
Ola
Tomato Man. Living in a Tomato Land.
FerociousMonk
I don't really know what the dates/rules are specifically but Strudwick was not eligible to play in the play-offs because he came from another league and was signed after a certain date. So I doubt Jagr could be signed for a play-off run this year by any team. He could be signed and play out the remainder of the reg season though (like Struds) if the rules are the same this year.
NYStranger
tdchi- All players signed after a certain date have to pass through waivers. Hence signing JJ is hard. But, that rule doesn't always apply, I am not 100% sure when it doesn't. But like Jason Strudwivk didn't have to pass through waivers when we signed him a while back. It have something to do with the contract status of the player in Europe.
Ola
DRURY- Another thing to consider... Drury is getting tons of praise in the press for his Olypic play ... I agree is has played well but think his performance has been over-hyped so far... The goal he scored was classic cherry picking.. The USA forward (Ryan??) aggresive play in front not only freed up the puck to Drury but also tied up both defenseman and distracted the goalie. it was a classic example of what the NYRs need more than anything.. aggresive power forward... Drury is only playing about 10 minutes a game in the Olypics... on the 3 or 4th lines... he has played well.. no doubt but lets not hand him the MVP...
schneidw
CHINSTRAP- I respecfully disagree with you in your statement that DRURY has been WAY better than REDDEN since both signed ridiculously inflated contracts. In truth, both players are far-underperforming on the offensive side of their respective games and whille Drury is certainly better defensively, the games that I have seen show Redden to be relatively effective at clearing the puck... I acknowledge the lack of physical play by Redden makes him a liabiility when you consider his point production.. but at the same time, Drury is not exactly physical ala Canahan either..
schneidw
All that would do is let the other team use their best defensive players to defend one line. Now how can that hulking defender and defensive forward defend Gabby one shift and then JJ the next? Stacking one line is not a good tactic.
DanyloHalytskyj
Dany – It's all wishful thinking on my part, none of it rooted anywhere near reality...BUT...you asked my reasoning, so here it is: JJ, even at 38, is a HUGE player that creates an immense amount of space on the ice. The best way to defend against him is to have a large defenseman with good reach or to double team him. So...if you have to dedicate your best defensive defenseman to containing Jagr, what do you do with Gaborik? And then what about Jokinen? Such a line has an immense amount of size and talent. I would think they'd pose a serious threat in the zone...Realistically speaking though, the Rangers don't have the money to spend on Jagr, even it were for a PO rental. And if he were to take less than market value, I bet he'd be heading to the Igloo with Super Mario.
tdchi
Why would you play your leading scorer out of position (where he looked uncomfortable in his very short stint this year) to accomodate a 38 year old JJ. Personally I hope these Olympics have shown Torts that it may be wise to move Drury to the second line maybe on LW. Have Dubi/Prospal/Gabby as one line and Drury/Jokinen/Cally as the second
DanyloHalytskyj
From the NY TImes:'... “Ovechkin is crazier,” Jagr conceded the other day when asked to compare himself to Ovechkin. But Jagr, though 38 now and with flecks of gray in his beard, has been playing with such youthful physical abandon in these games that he has begun to talk about returning to the N.H.L. next season...' Now could someone in Europe clarify this for me...Doesn't the KHL end in mid-March? Couldn't a NHL team conceivably pick up a UFA from the league for a cup run? Critics aside, I'd love to see a Gaborik-Jokenin-Jagr line...I know JJ ain't what he used to be...but the guy still has MAD skills. He looked REAL good in the Czech-Russian game...Now onto bongland...wouldn't it be a trip to have him for the last month of the season? Count me as one who would love to see a JJ return.
tdchi
Dany- Thats possible. It just seems though, that like when someone only puts up numbers, especially from the PP, it don't get a ton of recognition.
Ola
i would think it's to early to say DZ will never be a Norris candidate as it is to early to say he will be. Basically, to win a Norris you need to score about 15 goals and get 45 or so assists and be somewhat responsible defensively. You can put up greater numbers than that and suck defensively and still win and put up slightly smaller numbers offensively but be a beast defensively. The offensive potential is there. he also like to hit and keeping in mind that he will still be filling into his body the next couple of years and learning more about the defensive game in the NHL he may eventually have a shot. Will there be better players overall - probably, but they also can have an off season or get hurt.
DanyloHalytskyj
Vic- Agreed, Id put him in a wide range; from like a Rafalski/Zidlicky to like Zubov. But in that mold. PP specialist. Great with the puck 5 on 5. Never really in the Norris race though.
Ola
VIC: I think MDZ can get more of a top gear...think about it, if he had gone back to Junior for his last , two years? or one?, doesnt really matter, look how may kids in junior who skate WITH the rest of the junior players one year, and the next skate PAST them every play. MDZ is still young, and I would imagine he could pick up his top speed a bit. Hell even Orr inproved his speed over the time he was in NY. I dont expect MDZ to become the fasted skater on the team, but I would bet he doesnt get beat to as many pucks in a couple of years.
Wildcard
OLA: I don't know what MDZ's ceiling is as a player and I think he has a real chance to be more then a RAFALSKI type player. We already know the kid has excellent vision, anticipation and passing skills. Earlier in the year he was carrying the puck more and going on end to end type rushes (as was GILROY). I think the Rangers muzzled that aspect of his game for now but it is there and when he matures he could be in the "special" category of offensive defensemen. The two things that might hold him back are his defensive play and his overall top speed. He is quick but if you notice he has trouble in long footraces to loose pucks. He doesn't have that top gear. Maybe his skating continues to develop but at this point I don't know if it is going to change much. As for his defensive play, I think he will get better with coaching, experience and confidence. Right now I am just enjoying watching him play, even with the mistakes he makes.
Vic
Realistically, MDZ will end up in the Boyle/ Rafalski/ Zubov/ Zidlicky/ Kimmo Timmonen mold. Nothing wrong with that, he is easily top 5 of the players we have drafted the last 20-30 years. Of the names I mentioned, several have been key players on cup winning teams. Tampa don't win without Boyle. NYR/Dallas don't win without Zubov. NJD don't win one of their cups at least without Rafalski. Timmonen have played a huge part in making Philly respectable again after their 30th overall finish. But I don't see him ever really challenging for a Norris, like Doughty definitely have potential to do... All I care about now is that we find one right shooting D who also have elite offensive punch.
Ola
tdchi- You are wrong, I am not underestimating the impact of that! ;) Seriously though, when you evaluate Slats -- its stops RIGHT THERE imo. He'll draft great players, he'll draft sheitty players. He'll sign great UFA's, he'll sign worthless UFA's. He'll make great trades, he'll make worthless trades. In the end, you can say that about most GM's. They have either done it, or is bound to do it... I also believe that Slats works as hard as anyone to make this a good team. But, with Slats, and while he have a big stack on his worthless UFA signings account, there is more that is missing. Something that you can't forgive. And thats a FUNDAMENTAL lack of understanding of what it takes to win in the game of hockey TODAY. And if anything, the 3 moves he made when dumping Betts, Sjöström, Korpikoski and Orr -- "illustrates" that lack of competence. We had almost turned the entire team over. We had made room on the blueline for two kids. We had dumped our 1st line C and brought in Gaborik. We had aquired two top 3 line wingers who were supposed to fit Torts system, Higgins and Kotalik. We had made room for a kid in a top 3 line environment in Anisimov. We had signed Prospal, or where bound to sign someone like that at least. All in all, we had turned over 33% of the team 6 new players of 18. Thats one third. Then he stands there and have to make a decision about our 4th line and a young utility player with some potential in Korpikoski. What does he do? He decides to try and upgrade ALL FOUR. Why? In that situation, when one third of your team is new, your coach is new, why do you take that decision. A decision that results in 56% of your roster being turned over before a season, and that only results in a new 4th line and Lisin for Korpikoski. Betts for Boyle. Orr for Brash. Sjöström for whoever. The only explanation is that Glen Sather does not in any way or form pay attention to such things as chemistry in the lockerroom, chemistry on the ice -- MODERN coaching all together. To him a coach seems to be someone who gives order before teh game that the players can go out and excute. If we look at the best teams in this league -- does that type of coaching characterize them? Detroit? NJD? Its years of drilling. Building a identity. Creating a environment where new players can come in and play to their strengths only at first, so that they then after a while can become a natrual part of the team. Et c. That type of staff isn't in Glen Sathers world of imagination. Stability, whats that? Can't a coach take 18 players who basically haven't each other and turn it to a great team instantly? Its just braindead to make that decions. The moves isolated might be okey, thats why Slats made them, but from a big picture its braindead. But Slats don't have a big picture.
Ola
Remember that Doughty only had 27 points last year in his rookie seaon, I think Del Zotto is on pace for 30-35 so you never know but I do think Doughty is a more well-rounded defender and is just as much of an offensive threat as Del Z. I believe Del Z makes better outlet passes out of the defensive zone but Doughty uses his speed to his advantage. Both of them look like the real deal and will be important contributors to their teams
rosch2000
Jake- It's Drew Doughty. In my opinion, Doughty is a future Norris Trophy winner, he is going to be a great one. I don't think DZ is in his class. He could end up being a good d-man. but Doughty is all ready something special. Cheers.
MC
Jake - It's tough to say...I don't think MDZ has the shot that DOUGHTY brings to the LA powerplay...but MDZ can pass with the best of them...his homerun pass is second to none, IMO...Interesting enough, Doughty had some real defensive struggles in his first year in the NHL...Those appear to be a thing of the past now, however...Supposedly, MDZ had the talent to be a top-10 pick, but his attitude sank him to 17...I don't doubt the kid is going to be a star when he matures though.
tdchi
Dany - I hope Canadians file that comment back in their minds for when they lose the gold medal game...Uncle Daddy should be the first to be tarred and feathered...Bob - I had Canada pegged for the gold myself...but nearly a loss to the Swiss, plus a loss to the US...I think there's a situation on that bench that suggests there are too many chiefs and not enough indians. It really is a lineup that has a dearth of role players. The closest they have in that vain is BERGERON and MARROW. Even those guys would be considered stars by most objective observers. I think the fatal flaw to them may very well be the fact that they're TOO powerful...and someone mentioned it...there's no one line that rises above the rest...I mean how the hell do you tell some of those guys to take a seat for two-thirds of the game?!?...Chin - I think Drury's issues with the Rangers are a combination of him playing more conservatively and him being pigeonholed into that role by his coach. I do agree, he doesn't have the right complements on his team to really maximize his effectiveness...I will note that DRURY and CALLAHAN are doing now many of the things that were done by KORPIKOSKI, SJOSTROM and BETTS --three defensive-minded forwards with good speed who could go out against top units and shut them down...I think one thing Wallsters CONSTANTLY underestimate is the role they played here, which is now being footed in part by the aforementioned players and at times, BOYLE. I have no doubt that Dru on a team with a stronger defense would be scoring between 25 and 30 goals a season...still not worth his contract...but like you said. That ain't his fault.
tdchi
Great game last night ...Crosby cemented his title of BABY ... what a disgrace ... pleading with the refs all night ... Question for the board ,,, I value your opinions... it might be too early to tell but ... Can DelZotto be as good as Glen Doughty of LA ...when all is said and done ?
Jake0104
as per aol...... X - D
stevielegs
And one last thing--youre missing the whole point if you say "shame on DRURY for rising to the occassion on Team USA and not the Rangers"...like i've said, i truly believe the pieces around him are in place to ALLOW him to rise to the occasion on Team USA. No matter how hard he tries, he's simply not talented enough to 'rise to that level' with what's around him on the Rangers.
chinstrap
RF4L--I know you werent the one to say that about the money. Regardless, this is just a difference of opinion between us. You seem to think (and many agree with you) that DRURY doesnt play his ass off and do all he can to try and make things work as a Ranger. I do. He will NEVER have the success he's having with Team USA, because he's a complimentary player at this point in his career, and thats pretty much fact. He will never live up to his contract, because he's just not good enough on his own to do so (probably never WAS), but again, I put that on SATHER, not DRURY. He wanted to come here and SATHER made that offer. He'd have been insane to refuse. I just get sick of people killing DRURY and acting like he's REDDEN or ROZEY, who dont seem to care half the time. From all inside accounts, nobody cares more than DRURY. Does that always bare out on the ice? Definitely not. But I think we're seeing what a valuable player he is when he's used in the proper role. But again, he's being paid as a first line center, not to play the role he's good at--3rd liner, great PKer and leader.
chinstrap
danylo: OMG, what a nob. If you can't admit blame, just keep your mouth closed.
RF4L
Quote from Uncle Daddy - "I thought I made some key saves in the game to turn it around, but we just didn't take advantage of it." - what a douche! Even after sucking balls like he did he still tries to deflect blame on everyone else.
DanyloHalytskyj
chin: Of course I'd not say no to that sort of money (or something comparable in my line of business) but I would downright embarassed to be the 2nd highest paid player on the team and not producing. He accepted that money under the pretense of producing like he did in Buffalo and he hasn't come close. And this year, he's on pace for 14 goals - FOURTEEN GOALS! And if your argument about Redden sucking even worse playing against stiffer competitive is true, then shame on Drury rising to the occasion for Team USA while not doing the same for Team Ranger.
RF4L
chin: Of course I'd not say no to that sort of money (or something comparable in my line of business) but I would downright embarassed to be the 2nd highest paid player on the team and not producing. He accepted that money under the pretense of producing like he did in Buffalo and he hasn't come close. And this year, he's on pace for 14 goals - FOURTEEN GOALS! And if your argument about Redden sucking even worse playing against stiffer competitive is true, then shame on Drury rising to the occasion for Team USA while not doing the same for Team Ranger.
RF4L
IMO--I was surprised at how chippy Canada's players were last night. What happened to the referees? They sure overlooked a lot of stuff from both sides. I believe Canada will win the gold medal. They will beat Russia, and go on to win. As for the USA, they are now playing with house money. If they get to the gold medal game, I would be thrilled regardless of the outcome. However, should they encounter a team with a real good goalie (Sweden, Finland) they could just as easily be out. Last night's outcome was great, but Canada had the puck most of the night and Miller cannot be expected to withstand an onslaught like that again.
Bob
And I really am sad Nash signed long term in Columbus. That is a guy that shouldn't be buried in Columbus.
DanyloHalytskyj
I will say this, Ryan would look good in a Ranger sweater next to Drury and Cally every night!
DanyloHalytskyj
Its amazing that some people refuse to give DRURY any credit. Yes, we KNOW he isnt earning his money or scoring enough as a Ranger. But now I have to hear "REDDEN would be better on Canada's blue line with all that talent". That is total f'ing BS. If REDDEN were in this tourney,he'd be even WORSE, because he's playing against the best of the best and all the players are good. His negatives would be exacerbated that much more playing against faster, more skilled guys every game. DRURY needs a little support to play his game, that much is obvious. But Christ, dont take away the fact that he's played well. And I laugh at the "he asked for 7 mil, why doesnt he start earning it". The agent asked for 7 mil OR SATHER offered it. Would YOU say no to it? Come on.
chinstrap
I think one of Canada's biggest issues has been a total lack on continuity within the lines. 13 forwards and 7 defensemen all getting somewhat equal icetime doesn't work, especially when you realize most of these guys, if not every one of them, are used to 20+ minutes a game. Finding their rhythm is tough that way. In addition, the constant line juggling is counter-productive. I get the fact that the team hasn't played together so it's sometimes a case of hoping 'instant' chemistry happens. But, that's the nature of the beast. I agree Brodeur was average and for sure, outplayed by Miller and therefore, Luongo is a logical decision. However, I am hoping and anticipating that Babcock will tell 1 forward and 1 d-man they likely won't see the ice against the Germans and go with more set lines. In addition, it's time he decided on a number 1 line and play that trio accordingly (ie more icetime than anyone else). Another observation of mine is the unimpressive play of the 2 of Canada's older players. Both Neidameyer and Pronger haven't impressed me and Pronger especially, looks slow. Finally, I question the lack of a shutdown defensive pair. To date, such a pairing really hasn't been needed because the puck hasn't been in the Canadian end so much, but when the US (and the Swiss) did press, there was plenty of running around by the Canadians. At the risk of getting ahead of myself here, such behaviour could prove lethal against the Russians, meaning any medal aspirations may all be moot. Finally, Joe Thornton is once again coming up small when the games are big. Believe it or not, but Big Joe has cumulatively in 3 games ONE SHOT ON NET. If I were a San Jose fan I'd be just a tad concerned!!!
RF4L
E- Yeah, I also like how team USA is structured. Skilled and slick centers in Pavelski and Statsny. One bigger PF on each line, Langenbrunner, Malone, Ryan and Backes. And a winger on each line who have more of a free offensive role; Parise, Kessel and Kane. But in terms of style, what you win with in the game today, I think you can hold on to the puck even more... And I really think thats our chance against teams like Pittsburgh and Washington. You cannot hunt down and bang teams like that. Crosby, Malkin and AO can play that style as well as anyone... To bad that we are going in a completely different direction with this team.
Ola
I think the thing about the US squad as some of you made mention of is the design of the team. This team was built around Burke's philosophy for a winner. They bang, pressure the puck everywhere and go to the net hard. The two man forechecking had the Canadian defense on their heels all night. The hard work keeping the game east west between the lines was solid. I think that Canada got outworked. I think that Canada will adjust and get more cohesive. They played the last 5 minutes with a lot of desperation and the US was pinned in their end to the point of exhaustion. That skill level if it continues to mesh would severely change the complextion of this tourney. Just a great hockey game played though. I love the way that Brian Burke thinks when it comes to building a winner. Big banging bodies with a lot of speed. He knows that playoff hockey and tourney hockey can be won not by the skill alone but by the imposing of will that wears out the other team
E
Another thing I was thinking...Perhaps Canada got a bit of a ego explosion from their blowout of Norway...I saw that score and I thought, shit...that's how the rest of the tourney will be...Also seems to me their guys really aren't on the same page out there. I know they said they chose successful components of successful NHL teams(i.e. the San Jose contingent), but it seems like those forces may be working against each other...One moment sticks out in my mind...when Pronger and two other Canadians collided. It looked like something from the three stooges...something I might suspect from Norway or Latvia...but the top seeded team in the Olympics? Certainly not...But I bet those guys come out with guns firing their next game...I sure as shit wouldn't want to be playing them.
tdchi
All I gotta say is WOW...I think that was the best hockey game I've seen in a goddamn long time...maybe even since the cup victory...After the first period, I already felt like I'd watch 60 minutes of hockey...I was looking at the clock thinking, 'shit, we've got 40 more minutes of this?'...BABCOCK SERIOUSLY underestimated the US, plain and simple. UNCLE DADDY(LOVE that nickname) was a bad choice...the minute I heard he was in net, I new the Americans' chances for wining just multiplied...In a tournament like this, you have to pick a goalie, and if he's hot, stick with him. Luongo should have been in net, plain and simple...Not to take anything away from the US. They played about as fundamentally solid game as they come. The only real gaff I noticed was they failed to pick up CROSBY in the third...that last goal by Canada should have never happened. Four guys just watched the Crier waltz in...I was screaming HIT HIM at the top of my lungs. I don't think they heard me in Vancouver....I think the best player for the US thus far(outside of MILLER of course) has been RAFALSKI. That guy is has been having a hell of a tournament...Also agree RYAN and BACKES have been solid. DRURY too. I think his play in the tournament is more indicative of how fool proof the defense is, rather than the strength of the overall team. Fact is, EJ and Orpik are walls back there. That allows Dru to drive hard to the net and stay deep in the zone. With the RANGERS, it doesn't seem to me that he plays as deep. And that's probably because he knows the puck is one turnover away from getting riffled at Lundqvist....BTW...with all the props to Drury, it should be mentioned that CALLAHAN is also having a very strong tournament. The guy is hitting anything that moves....even moreso than with the Rangers....something that has amazed me a bit is that PARISE hasn't stood out at all. Ditto with STASTNY. If those two guys start lighting up the lamp, this could become a VERY interesting tournament...Another sign of how great that game was...even KESLER's empty netter was a sweet goal!! That was a hell of a play he made to win that battle AND score...The announcers were quick to say it last night, but it's true...this is only the beginning...and I think Canada will be doing a serious gut check after this loss and the tie to Switzerland.
tdchi
Typical Cally though-blocked a key shot in that sequence-which was a big reason Canada didn't score.
puckyou
And I also agree that Drury looks better because, in part, he's playing with better players, but as stevie says, so would Wade Redden if he was on the Canadian backline. That doesn't excuse his pathetic offensive output this year and the fact that he really hasn't potted one of his legendary clutch goals since signing his nice big fat contract.
RF4L
puckyoyu...funny you mentioned the shift where Cally couldn't clear the puck. I have seen that so many times as a Rangers fan that without knowing it was Cally that made that play, I was sure it was either him or Drury who did it.
pete
Dunno if I agree Brodeur's been overrated his entire career, but I do agree his game has declined in the past few years but that's been hidden to a great degree by the machine that plays in front of him. However, as we've noted on here several times, come PO time the cream rises to the top and the machine in front of Brodeur becomes less effective, thereby exposing Brodeur to more quality shots and look at the results: Early PO exits for the past few years due to large part to mediocre goaltending. If I was running Team Canada, Broduer would have been the 3rd goalie. That would have allowed the coaching staff to juggle Fleury and Luongo instead. Luongo now is the man and Babcock and company have no choice but to hope he comes through - can't go back to Broduer with any confidence now.
RF4L
The shift with a few minutes left, when Cally didn't clear the zone, where they were stuck in their own end w/Canada buzzing-was scary. I was almost sure they would tie it there-but was psyched they didn't. FYI-Crosbaby crying to the refs all game-only guy on either team working the refs-it's sickening. Great player-but world-class-pussy.
puckyou
OLA: I have been saying that about MARTY for 15 years. He was/is a very good goaltender that has had his career stats vastly inflated due to the team that he played on. It used to kill me watching RICHTER hung out to dry on a nightly basis facing an absurd amount of breakaways and odd-man rushes. Meanwhile, MARTY was facing mostly harmless shots from the outside and the very rare rebound that his D failed to clear. Again, I'm not saying MARTY sucked. It has always been clear to me that he has been overrated his entire career. Anytime the Devils have struggled with their system or their D in general MARTY has looked pedestrian. That is the reality. A great goaltender....yes. The best goaltender or one of the top goaltenders of all time..... no. Even though the stats will say that he is I know he isn't.
Vic
BTW, did anyone see the story in the Post about Bobby Ryan? Some heavy stuff... And, in some aspects, somewhat cool too. Hi my name is Bobby Stephenson but I call myself Bobby Ryan since I've lived half my life in hideing from the police because my father was accused, and later convicted, of attempt to murder.
Ola
Jagr gave a great interview with Swedish tv. All the experts went like "Hmm, that didn't sound like the Jagr we know". He among other things said something like "The pain from getting hit disapears with time. But the fact that I made a mistake that cost us the game, that pain will never go away". Not to get into his sepration with NYR and stuff like that, whats done is done, but I have to say that at this point I am proud that he was a Ranger and I really wish him to do well in this tournament. A great character. He have his fair share of ghosts for sure, but he is also obviously working extremely hard to do the right things. I mean, 10 years ago he was basically one of the biggest jerks ever in the game. Seriously. He did something to correct that, thats impressive. You don't see that all that often.
Ola
"I do not care about the check, I care about the turnover," said Jagr. "It was my mistake. I made a bad decision."
stevielegs
So Drury The Captain needs a stronger environment. Maybe he can't handle NYC. Good let him go find one. What was his excuse the 2 years before this? Seems to me he's playing harder and better at the games, the rest is fan spin. He's suppose to be leading and making guys around him better. He asked for $7 mil per, he got, now earn it already. And Redden would be so much better too if the roster was stronger. .....if ifs and buts were candy and nuts......NN are you saying the game would of had the same amount of viewers on NBC as MSNBC?......
stevielegs
CM- Yeah, when you see Drury in a stronger environment he instantly looks better. He have been on strong teams all his career before coming here, and he have always been good then. In the end though, again, I still think, and always have, basically that Drury had been an okey signing at like 5m per. Then we would basically get a 3m player, and overpay 2m for leadership et c. Now its just too much...
Ola
I am 100% serious, IE I am not "agitating" or something, when I say that Brodeur haven't been elite for the last 4-5 years at least. People are underrating NJD's defense tremendously. When they don't have 4 players in his lap, he looks very avg -- ALL the time. He would never survive on a avg team in the NHL. Then he have some strengths of course. His glove is awesome. He is great with the stick. He have a ton of experience. He can really eat up a shooter. But IMHO, no way he have been more then a 15-25th overall goalie in this league the last 4-5 years. Manny Fernandez have been great for Minnesota, Brodeur is better then Manny and he have put up great stats thanks to NJD's defense.
Ola
Marty's career is winding down now Lou's got bigger problem than resigning Kovy, he's got to find #1 goalie to replace Marty.
ilya
Did Roenick mea culpa today after basically saying that Drury wouldn't provide much to the USA team? I'm one who doesn't think Drury has sucked as bad as many on here, but he and Rafalski, the old men of the squad, were pretty important guys on that team today. For the record, I want Canada to win the gold because of the Canadian in me and because I know how much this means to the country. But it's awful hard to not get excited by the American effort and Marty's Mediocrity.
ColoradoMark
By the way, if you apply the "Star Trek" theory to NBC's Olympic coverage of skiing, you can easily tell what's going to happen. Just like the poor schlep that got beamed down to the planet with Kirk, Bones and Spock was doomed, so are the no- names that are shown during prime time. Medal winners, Americans and yard sales are all that are shown. As soon as they announced that the 41 year old skier from Switzerland was able to keep skiing because he remained injury free, I knew it was "agony of defeat " footage coming my way.
ColoradoMark
VIC- Right on. I have this argument with my wife all the time. She keeps talking about how the Olympics should be for amateurs only. The problem is that world never existed (except maybe the first few modern Olympics). As far as hockey is concerned, the Americans and the Canadians were the only ones who played by the rules and the NHL wasn't as global as it is now. And if you think about it, most of those college kids receive academic scholarships (and Canadian juniors receive stipends) based solely on their athletic skill, so who is to say what constitutes a professional? I'm all for the best playing the best. This tournament is incredible. You have at least six teams that could contend for gold and the lesser teams aren't that bad. The World Jrs is an excellent tournament and it's held every year. The Olympics is once every four years and it wouldn't be as special if we applied the old rules to it today.
ColoradoMark
Vic: Backes is just awesome, plain and simple. Physically, he is exactly what the Rangers need. He crashes and creates space. As for Dru... I definitely think he would be more productive if we had the ability to create the types of scrums that he scored off of. He has a nose for the trenches... not so much when it comes to a transitional game. If he was with some bigger bodies and could play his 'loose change' type of game, he would get his.
Z
Vic: I agree in Stasny. Didnt check the ice time totals but I was wondering when they were going to try and put somebody else is his spot. He seems kind of listless
RDW
Tremendous hockey. I love the Olympic Hockey tournament and I particularly like the way it is now. I know a lot of folks are nostalgic about the way it used to be (with amateurs) but the quality of hockey in this tournament is off the charts. The Miracle team will always be special to me as I was a still 12 years old at the time but even I know that the odds of something like that happening again were astronomical. No, the tournament is better with the best players in the world going at it head to head. I don't want it to end because I know that when it does I will be back to watching Ranger games again and cursing at the TV. Speaking of the Rangers, DRURY has played better in this tournament then he has during his entire Ranger tenure. Is it the level of play and the level play of the guys around him that is elevating his game or is it something else? Is he another guy that for whatever reason cannot bring his A game when wearing a Ranger jersey? CALLY has been his usual self and has played great in the limited time he has been getting. He made a few gaffes today but overall played well. The guys on Team USA that have made the biggest impression on me so far have been KESSLER, BACKES and RYAN. The guy that has made the least impression on me so far has been STASTNY.
Vic
Nice to watch Brodeur get beat by his own players and as usual...all the pressure will be off him just like being in New Jersey cuz Fleury will have to carry medal round. Unlike Gomez and Gionta...it is actually pretty easy to pull for US born Devils this time.
shonuff
Dreger: When asked about Brodeur's play tonight, Babcock said "we would have liked to be better in that area
PatrickDiv
Agreed on fatso...looked a bit off, especially with his play of the puck- normally his forte. Fleury in place of Luongo? Really?
PatrickDiv
Great game tonight. Let the 6 y/o stay up to watch it and he was screaming his lungs out at the hits! Feel good for Drur...I feel even better that he looks good enough to trade for- LOL
PatrickDiv
RF4L----you beat Russia and you will get the gold medal. Meanwhile, the likelihood of the US beating Sweden/Finland is even at best. Uncle Daddy was not good....he seemed to be trying to do too much.....or maybe he thought that was the Rangers in those 1960 USA uniforms.
Bob
As for the NHL players competing in the games... I have to agree with LB. A game like that is good for hockey! Think about it this way... ever other professional league is still going to send their best and brightest from all over Europe. Are we basically setting the US and Canada specifically up to be the ones that can't compete because the NHL is THE league in North America? I'm sure it really comes down to $$$ for the NHL, since they don't get any bread for it, but you can't ell me that this isn't good for hockey!
Z
From a Canadian perspective, the good news is this game likely will be Brodeur's last in this Olympics - he looked off tonight. I've thought all along Fleury deserves a shot.
RF4L
WOW! That was one hell of a game! Entertaining from start to finish. one thing that you just notice right off the bat is the skill level. The USA is a bunch of pluggers with heart... the Canadians are just flat out talented. Miller stood on his head tonight, and boy wasn't that just unbelievable. Good to see Drury actually becoming an pretty integral part. 2 goals (and a big one tonight) and the he's starting to see some more meaningful minutes out there. All in all, man... this has been a great tournament for hockey in genreal. They are playing at such a high level it's insane. Great to see it! Speaking of Rangers (or exs), JJ looks good out there. That guy just has so much charisma. I'm sure he'll be back in the nHL next season and I, for one, would love to see him back on the Rangers. Never gonna happen, of course, but man... I just like that guy!
Z
I want Avery on our team now !!!
HamiltonHellhound
I have said all along Luongo should be the # 1 for us, Uncle Daddy for the last 10 games looks really average, more so out of position, looks lost out there
HamiltonHellhound
how much do Ranger fans living in Canada hate fatso now. drury scores the type of goal he used to. Maybe he isn't being used correctly??????? Who ever was saying we should target bobby ryan at the beginning is 100% correct. the kid is very good. enjoyable 2 games so far today.
KIS
Uncle Daddy..........LOL. Let's face it.......unless Ryan Miller is the next Mike Richter......you cannot bet outplayed so badly and win consistently.
Bob
And Joe "Slow" Throton looks slow, no wonder why he always sucks in the big games
HamiltonHellhound
Kessler with a hilite goal, great hustle and Miller should be charged by the RCMP, he stole the show and Uncle Daddy, you f*cking suck
HamiltonHellhound
Since the Team USA White jersey's are very similar to the Ranger whites..doesn't Parise look better in Red, White and Blue then Red and Black :(
DOUBLEN
For those complaing that this game is on MSNBC, the Ice Dancing will do better ratings compared to what this game would have done in prime time. The highest rated event for the Winter Olympics is always the Finals for the Women's Figure Skating.
DOUBLEN
Are international hockey riules on interference different than NHL? There is obstruction and picks all over the place.
Bob
Nash and Doughty has impressed e the most for CDN
HamiltonHellhound
Why can't Drury win any puck battles along the board in a Rangers jersey!? Rick Nash is a beast! Too bad he's lost in Columbus.
NYRinMN
Someone looks a lot better with good players around him!
chinstrap
Definitely a very entertaining hockey game.
DanyloHalytskyj
Come on Orpik, lay a good one on Cindy, pretty please!!!
NYRinMN
screw the Olympics & NBC the proud as a peacock NHL network not playing the game on NBC, instead on mslsd. And the next game is at midnight...... GTFOOH.....
stevielegs
Rf: connelly:...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRi6UwZSbz8
mf
UNCLE Daddy is playing like Grandpa Daddy
HamiltonHellhound
Holy shit what a hit by Ovechkin on Jagr....
PatrickDiv
RF4L and HH----yes. The stuff Canadian fans were writing on the blogs after the 2 games against the USA in this years world jr's was crazy. All kinds of smack talk after the first game, won by Canada.....then killing every Canadian involved after the final as well as killing America. I am happy that my kid play's Canada's sport. It gives me more opportunity to go to Canada and interact with Canadians.
Bob
Anyone else think the quality of reffing has been much better in the Olympics than in the NHL? In the games I have watched have been very satisfied with the refs and how they have called the games whereas in the NHL you notice mistakes by refs about 5-10 times a period.
DanyloHalytskyj
Canada is also the best. Like sure, the russians have a ton of talent. But Canada is ALWAYS the team to beat. Does fans in Boston like the Yankees? Does fans in Sweden like Canada? Nope. At least not when Sweden is playing against them, early in a tournament, we watch in awe, if we are eliminated, I think most see Canada as a winner as well as anyone else (as long as the finns don¨t win). But when we are bound to meat -- of course the top team isn't liked. Starting with teh Canada Cup, their have ALSO been some real fishy, documented, stuff going on. That stuff is so unnecessary. Hockey canada lives in a vacum, Canadian media is 100% compareable to Pravda cover the Soviet Party in the Soviet Union in the 70's. Like they can pull any sheit they want, TSN and co will only help and cheer on. They have no clue about how its seen in the rest of the world, nobody would stand it if they did. If the Swedish hockey federation organized a WC/WJC and pulled some of the stunts we have seen lately -- the press would be all over it and the fans would boycot the tournament. I think its like that in Russia/Finland/Czech Rep/everywhere. But in Canada its different. But in some sense, that only adds a element to hockey that you don't have like in Soccer.
Ola
HHH some started a while ago with the refs being biased towards Montreal in the playoffs especially. They seemed to favor Canadian teams. Now it mostly favoring crybaby and the playpens.
stevielegs
Look, the dream about a WJC in the Olympics -- will NEVER happened. I mean, I can understand fans talking about it. But when I hear experts talk about it -- I really start to wonder about em. How the Olympics is played is decided about a vote between the members of the IIHF. How many would vote for juniors in the Olympics? Yeah, at the most two nations. The US and Canada. If no NHLers, Sweden would much rather send their SELers. Russia would of course insist very strongly on their KHLers. Like come on, it will NEVER happened. Its like saying "we should send amatures". Well who are amatures today? Yes the beerleaguers, nobody else.
Ola
Rethorics- But you get what I mean, like a boost thats like twice as big as after the NYR won in 94' -- or something like that. You know how it is with sports, all of a sudden something catches on. Thats what the NHL need. The product is good, no doubt. And the NHL have really sheitty numbers to speak clear french. I am not talking about the NHL catching up the NFL, extremely far from it. But in terms of TV numbers -- the NHL should have potential to do twice as good, at least, compared to what they are getting now.
Ola
BOB & E I echo RF4L thoughts, thanks guys. I think where the resentment comes from is not so much against Canada, it is against players like Marty and Crybaby. I hated Kieth K-Choke and Chelios especially when they plays for the USA and you want them to loose becuase of those 2 guys, then you get a class guy like Richter who played for the USA and you wish him well, every nation has its own Butt Hole Surfers who you love to hate, Claude Lemiuex I despised the most putting on a Canada jersey
HamiltonHellhound
It is real hard to develop any kind of intestinal disturbing animosity towards Canada. I love the country, find the people to be some of the nicest around. Maybe that is the issue with International hockey these days. I have no team that I hate. I find reasons to like almost all of them.
E
Bob: Thanks for the kind words about Canadians...I'm not sure what you mean, however, when you say ' the visceral reaction relative to Canada's national sport is puzzling'. Do you mean how we react we when lose? The collective soul-searching, interspective investigations to find out what went wrong??
RF4L
I'm personally torn by the choice to use professionals (NHLers) versus not. They certainly do tip the scales so that a real underdog team like Switzerland simply has almost no chance of winning a medal. It's one thing for a team to turn out a good showing against the Canadians and the Russians. But the Canadians, Russians, Americans, Swedes and then Finland? The chances are infinitesimally small. On the other hand, I hated those years when the Soviets would skate Makarov, Krutov and Larianov against what amounted to be a NCAA college all-star team....Hell, I remember one year(I think it was 1988), where the U.S. was even lit up by Germany. Ditto with Canada...BUT...there's a part of me that REALLY wishes the Olympics were more like the WJC. Certainly, the hockey isn't nearly as good. But comparing the past tourney versus the games now, it seems as though there's a fire the WJCs had that is strangely absent from the Olympics. It's not that I think ANY of the Olympians are dogging it. But rather the younger players have a sort of enthusiasm toward the game that really shines in heated competition. That game between Canada and USA this year was about as exiting a hockey game I've seen in recent years. Maybe I'll see more of that level of play tonight. I don't know...As for NHL and players getting injured, screw it. While the games certainly wear down guys, I don 't think the Olympics have ever had a dramatic impact on the ultimate outcome in the NHL...I was going to say the closest the games came to influencing the league was by knocking the Rangers out early in 2005-2006....but that quick exit had more to do with JAGR injuring his shoulder, which I believe occurred in the first game...so chalk me up for one who's on the fence I guess...
tdchi
HHH: He could be CEO of a dog walking business and he'd get fired by now..someone here just mentioned Mcdonough.. are any of the young d'men in the system ready to make a significant impact on the big club next year? You got to figure Rozi & possibley Girardi are gone to free up cap, another hole is created, we need a D'man, actually 2 .......re: Horton: do you have him playing 1st line center with Gabby ?
mf
RF4L and from a zip's blogger....."...Larry, I know you read this blog, well, because this is where you get all your ideas,....".....guess everyone thinks larry would be clueless without blogs. I prefer him over the other guys trying to be pc or worse.
stevielegs
That some in Canada consider the USA the #1 rival in hockey speaks to the vacuum that exists, and the lack of competence of the Russian national team organization. Let's face it.....Canada could have 2 teams in this competition and should win gold and silver. As for me....it was a lot more fun hating the USSR as a rival than it is Canada. Every NHL player I have ever met has been kind, humble and accommodating to my kids and the kids around them. This has been my exerience every time I have been to Canada..............wonderfully kind and outgoing people. Even when my kids have gone north to play hockey in very competitive tournaments, the Canadian families have been wonderful. This is why the visceral reaction relative to Canada's national sport is puzzling. Another country winning the world junior chanpionship is not an indication of any deficit in Canadian society.....yet it seems to elicit those kind of responses up north. Most Americans.....when cornered and trashed.......will respond in kind, so when this happens around hockey competitions, it is simply odd to me (and many of us down south). IMO....the only way Canada does not win is if they beat themselves. This game today is not important........games in the medal round are. So good luck to all. Hope todays games are all good ones.
Bob
It astounds me to no end how he keeps his job, if he was the CEO of a Wall Street buisness he would have been fired or even chraged for ripping off his employer, getting harder and harder to watch this team, another reason why I would rather play NHL 2010 and with me running the Rangers and also the Pack, both teams are built for war
HamiltonHellhound
HHH: Agreed on the junior players in the WJC - did you know that Grachev could have played for the Russians in this year's tourney but the genuises who make up the Ranger management elected to keep him with the Pack. Great decision, eh? The Pack suck and he's had a mediocre first professional season. Sather's incompetence is felt in every corner of the organization...incredible. SATHER SUCKS!
RF4L
And speaking of Candian heroes, Paul Henderson has been diagnosed with Luekemia-sp. Thanks to Paul Henderson that was the 1st time I kissed a girl, after he scored the big goal against the Ruskies in 72 my then girlfriend [ yeah 11 at the time ] jumped up all excited and kissed me.
HamiltonHellhound
mf: Interesting mock draft, but of course very meaningless at this point. I will say this: If the Rangers are sitting something like 7th and don't pick Brett Connolly, from what I have read, it would be a mistake - then again, isn't that often what shitbox Sather does anyways???
RF4L
And from a Canadian point of view, like the USA those Commie Russian bastards where always our big rival, now it is the USA. I remember the Canada Cup in 87 I think it was at Copps, and the USA had players like Chris Nilan, Curt Fraser etc on the team, the USA of all nations have raised there level of players and are a power force
HamiltonHellhound
1 thing that does piss me off, I would like to see the NHL clubs to be more flexable allowing thier JR players in the NHL who can play in the World Jrs let them play instead of keeping up with the NHL club
HamiltonHellhound
LB's point is a valid one and some of us have been mentioning that on here for quite some time (more proof that the wall is a source for LB). Except he could have expanded on that point by including in his argument that too date, all the extra picks the purge of 04 netted Sather have resulted in Staal, Cally and Dubinsky to far - a lowly return for something like 14 picks in rounds 1 to 4 in those 2 years. Shameful. SATHER SUCKS!
RF4L
Rhet than the NHL should not be a part of it. They cost the NYR a season in the last games. The off season is from June to September, hockey is played in Calif, Florida, Arizona , Texas, etc. and there is no big problem. Change it to the summer games , don't stop a pro season. And an injury is easier dealt with, and UFAs can put their balls on the line if the games are that important to them.
stevielegs
OLA... The Miracle on ice will never happen again because it was a bunch of College Nobody's beating a Russian team that just dominated everyone(they were basically a bunch of Pro's who played in the Russian Leagues)... add in the Cold War and it was totally different... IMO, They need to put the Olympics back in the hands of kids... get rid of all the professional ahtlete's... STEVIE... They're not going to play Hockey in the summer...
Rhet0ric
OLA the games should be held during the summer Olympics, and there should be an age limit. .....from lb...".We can talk about the crippling mistakes made in free agency. But none would have been necessary (to coin a Yogi-ism) had the Rangers just drafted well in 2003 and 2004, instead of turning a sixth-overall, a 12th-overall and a 19th-overall into Al Montoya, Hugh Jessiman and Lauri Korpikoski, respectively, when corresponding options could have produced Drew Stafford, Zach Parise and Travis Zajac. Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/olympics/nhl_all_about_players_P4au69hyCA1D6qFpGJqd6L#ixzz0gAvUDMiu ....that was the genius' attempt at rebuild with his right hand phony maloney baloney blame game. It's better to trade for a proven guy or sign them as a ufa. Take the same swings at the draft, but an Ovechkin is not in every draft, neither is a Jagr. And try lucky finding another Lundqvist. Certain players are worth the gamble to ride their coat tails. Jagr & The King were, except nyr management weren't and aren't good enough. And they never made the deadline moves needed to go for it. They stuck with mediocrity, and depended too much on good luck. Sather 's gambling balls shrink and disappear at crunch time......and Renney wasn't a good playoff coach.......
stevielegs
I agree 100% with Brooks about the Olympics. There might be something to win by going, there is nothing to loose. An easy equation. Sure, some individual players will get hurt, some teams will suffer because their player was hurt. But thats equal for everyone, other teams will gain from a rival being weakned. It don't hurt the league. And, the same injury could have happened in teh NHL just as well. And before we know it, we have another miricle on ice and hockey as a sport becomes more popular.
Ola
TDCHI, I hear what you are saying, but I can never cheer against the homeland. I normally go for the underdog in most sports, I will say the Swiss have impressed me, perhaps their head coach should be giving a look to coach over here, at least in the AHL.
HamiltonHellhound
MF... If anyone offers STAAL a deal of between $2,615,623 - $3,923,434 Million per year, they would have to give us a 1st and 3rd round pick for their trouble... I think he's pretty safe... STEVIE... I'm not a SATHER fan either, but things could always be worse... DOLAN could always fire Glen and bring back PHIL ESPOSITO:)
Rhet0ric
TD... I think 4 years at $10-11 Mil is very doable for STAAL... I don't care about how much he makes a year, the only thing that matters to me is the cap hit... I can't wait to get a look at MCDONAGH in camp... As far as bets go, a real RISKY one would be betting ROZI get's traded by the deadline or REDDEN's gone by camp... care to wager? ...MF... Various reports have us shopping DUBI, GIRARDI and GILROY... I have no problem dealing any of them as long as we bring youth back in return... IMO, HORTON would be a good fit for us, but we'd probably have to give up CALLY to get him... Another guy I would keep tabs on is PATRICK SHARP... Chicago is $2.5-3 MIL over the cap for next season and need to move him... TRADE FREEZE...Sather needs to get things off to a proper start by getting rid of BRASHEAR... even if we have to eat half his money, it's still better than paying for his entire $1.4 Mil next season... GM's are allowed to talk deals during the Olympic break, so I'm expecting a flurry of trades to happen as soon as the freeze is lifted... anyone hear any good rumors?
Rhet0ric
The Hockey Writers: Mock 1st round picks for the upcoming draft: ... http://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-2010-1st-round-mock-draft/
mf
tdchi there are no REBUILD chants, only fire sather chants. He can't rebuild .
stevielegs
should have read: what a clusterph...ck ! this team is..... its also amazing how all the bad little moves have added up big time to work against us.....Sather, retire, die, grope an intern, just leave..!
mf
Rozi is clearly the easiest to move of the big 3 unwanted contracts....I think that Staal will command more than 2.5 mill just on the basis that other teams will bid up for him and we'll have to compete to match....TD, must say part of your optimism about the team is winning me over........Just to state the obvious: some years drafts are much deeper with talent than others....This upcoming year seems to have 3 elite picks, after that, Rf mentioned some kid that seemed impressive, if we cant draft high (top 4) maybe slats trades away our #1 one for "something" and focuses on signing Kovalchuk..A talent like this is not available every year, and I dont know how good the talent is coming up next year or the year after........ I think Kov / ? / Gabby on the 1st is the way to go.(because I dont know if Kov / Oli will jive on the same line) ...Perhaps with Prospal / Christensen / Dubi centering the 1st line........2nd line Drury, Avery,or Prospal on the LW / Oli center / Dubi or Cally on the RW....There may be a suprise trade or 2 that nets us a different winger ....If Kovalchuk is too expensive, we need to sign a center or power forward..... And last, a Defenseman.....Semenov looked decent in spring training....a big body, seemed responsible enough in the brief time he was here, to move his man out of the crease, &move the puck out & up..... what a clusterph...ck ! .......Hopefully Sather doesn't turn over the entire roster again....4-5 players max, and let get used to each other....
mf
HHH - I understand why you would cheer for the Canadians...But if I were in your shoes, it would take the better part of a bottle of bourbon to help me see past the fact that Fatso and the Cryer are on that team...No offense, but I want Canada to lose SO BADLY it hurts. I would love nothing more than to see tears of frustration bubbling out of Crosby's eyes, and the dejected look on Marty's face knowing he'll never go to the Olympics again...On the RANKINGS...MAN did they make some stinker predictions...Like the PENGUINS at number one?!? They lost like a third of their team...and the Canes at SEVEN?!? Their entire defense was blown up...and the BRUINS at TWO?!? I called that demise back in pre-season, and let me tell you it ain't 'cause of the injuries...its called TIM THOMAS IS A SIEVE...stevie - That's pretty much the point I've been trying to make as the usual "REBUILD, REBUILD" chant fires up. The Rangers have an EXCELLENT frame work in place and I really foresee them building on it...the difference now is that they seem very willing to let the kids develop at their own pace, instead of rushing them to the bigs like they did back in the day...Dany - I agree pretty much, only I think you're going to see a marked improvement much sooner than you're predicting. Let's just say I'll be watching what happens with Grachev, Anisimov and Stepan VERY closely next fall. Ditto with McDonagh. I think there's a very real possibility all four start the year with the Rangers...Rhet - I see STAAL doing one of two things...either signing a short-term contract for about $2.5 million...or a longterm for $3 million. I don't think he'll go higher than that...I'd also be willing to bet ALL of Hospo's beer that one of Redden and Rozsival(probably the latter) will be gone by the time camp opens up next fall. Drury, I can guarentee, will be here until his contract is done or he's bought out. And I don't see him being bought out...
tdchi
well according to Ken, Gaboriks are easy to come by. He wants an Ovechkin. And is willing to tank and gamble one will be drafted by the NYR. He's in Barbie's Dream House, based on all the stars aligning in the age of aquarius. Just who is the next Ovechkin? And what year is he in the draft, and what's the chances the NYR get him ?.........and some think they can get another Lundqvist. It's now become give up elite talent to rebuild? ....this is beyond absurd.....it's replacing this mediocrity for a maybe. Try progressing beyond rather than regressing to go thru mediocrity again, to hopefully get lucky.
stevielegs
MF... How much do you think it's going to take to re-sign STAAL? He's a RFA, he's not going anywhere...though we do have cap issues... playing Voros in the minors will put us approximately at $12 Mil under the cap to re-sign JOKINEN, PROSPAL, PRUST, CHRISTENSEN and STAAL... Prospal, Prust and Christensen will get slight bumps over last year(Prospal still get's paid by the Lightning)... assuming Jokinen gets $5 MIL(though I wouldn't pay him that much) and Staal gets mid two's in salary, that will leave us with approximately $1.5 Mil to fill out the roster(3 or 4 players)... we would've had an extra $1.4 Mil, but next year we will be be charged that much of a cap hit to not have BRASHEAR play for us... while we can run over the cap in the pre-season, we will still need to clear some salary to sign any free agents or improve the team... STEVIE... I don't think SLATS needs approval to get rid of salary, as long as it appears he's trying to improve the team... I do think he'd need approval to bury salary in the minors with the intent of spending more... The KNICKS have no 1st Round pick this year, will have to swap next years 1st Rounder(they get the worse pick of the two picks) and also traded 2012's 1st Round pick... not to mention that in their most recent deal, they also shipped out a player who was a lottery pick... would you be willing to lose that much to get rid of Drury, Redden and Rozsival? We at least be left with KING, GABBY and some of our young assets... the KNICKS have much less...
Rhet0ric
Dany- that is where we agree - have some plan - Sather has to stop changing the roster with sideways moves every year. He has to stop filling every roster spot with UFAs and capping out so we can't carry an extra D man and forward so there is some sort of competition among the players for ice time. Other than DelZ and Anisimov (it was his turn) I don't see any other kid getting any kind of shot to break into the lineup. Read (I think it ) Zippay's blog on Parenteau and his thoughts on the subject. I just don't see any real movement on an annual improvement. I don't see any sort of plan which is a shame because the organization has some decent pieces in place but every year the deck gets reshuffled and nothing changes.
NYStranger
We should plan on being a strong team in 2012 and 2013 and work towards that goal. By then hopefully Grachev and Stepan will move up along with Sanguinetti and McDonough and hopefully we will have sent Redden anywhere. Drury's contract comes off the books and we have wiggle room to add what's needed.
DanyloHalytskyj
Last I checked we have a stud and his name is Gaborik. We also have a top notch goalie. We need to build around these two guys. The first step is creating cap space by getting rid of Redden and Rozie and using the money for some offense. I would include Drury in this purge but that is not going to happen.
DanyloHalytskyj
Ken now you want a STUD. Why not a fantasy team? The playpens got crybaby and milkin thru torture to their fans and taxpayers, and probably a fix and payoff to buttman. They had Lemieux and Jagr once too, they were better than the present 2. There is no cookie cutter formula. There is brains, balls, and good luck. Until The Caps win it all or make it to the finals, how are you correct? You might need to find a new team , dolan will not rebuild. And I'm glad he won't, and has no problem spending. Too bad the genius can't give him his money's worth. I'm sure there are guys drooling for his job. He's almost as bad as Waddell. How that guy has a job is a mystery. And how that pos buttman lets that garbage continue is a joke. He has no interest in the NYR winning The Cup nor getting to the finals. And his refs will help him in that quest.
stevielegs
I for one do not mind cheering for Crybaby, Uncle Marty and the Richards and Pronger, as much as I am a die hard Ranger fan, I am a Canadian 1st. And I am sure if the USA and Swedes meet in the final, how can you cheer for Henrik to win it all ? Indeed tomorrows game will be big, think I might even watch that one meself
HamiltonHellhound
Interesting article from TSN on preseason and ranking and current rankings of all 30 teams, http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=310605#YourCallTop
HamiltonHellhound
tdchi: I've struggled back and forth on this rebuild thing. I would agree completely with Ken's rebuild philosophy if this were 2003 or 2004. But right now we are at the point in which we have some good young players in the lineup and in the system as well as established stars, so I see no need for a total rebuild. But I would argue that this year should be a retooling year with a commitment to developing our young players which to some extent it has been. I'd rather be sellers this year, not for a total rebuild but more along the lines to collect young assets that could be used to possibly move up in the draft or trade for blue chip prospect. I'm all for being buyers when we have most of the pieces in place. So my stance as a Ranger fan is not total rebuild but more retool and develop.
davidsoc30
Starting to become a big Fan of the Swiss...Crosby the Cryer wins it...very sad indeed. Hiller was great. Looking forward to Sunday...becomes my Superbowl this year since teh Giants didn't make it..........
MelvilleFred
Ken - I hate to sound like I'm disagreeing for disagreement's sake, but holey hell man...Quick FYI - The Bolts are TIED with the train wreck Rangers(you know, the ones with NO talent) at this point...What's their differential you ask? NEGATIVE 22!! And BTW, that's more than twice what the defenseless Rangers' have(-8)...The Capitals, who were clearly one of the best teams in the league last year and had a roster FAR superior than the Penguins, couldn't get past the now cup-winning team. Why? Because as much as I hate FLEURY, he's a better goaltender...Look, I've played on a lot of hockey teams in my life, and I can tell you, I've never skated on a successful one that lacks good goaltending. Ask ANYONE who plays or played or even watches the sport with religious frequency and they'll tell you the same...Frankly, I'm amazed I'm even having this side-bar conversation with a Ranger fan who suffered through the post-Richter years...or better yet...the pre-Richter/Beezer years...."no team wins championships 'because' of their coach..." Bullshit. Plain and simple. Want proof? SEE: HERB BROOKS, 1980 OLYMPICS. GOLD MEDAL, USA. End of discussion...Torts, BTW, was chased out of Tampa. Once his GOALIE left, he couldn't win games there...As for his influence on the Rangers' roster, it's largely speculative absent Torts' own voice. He admitted to bringing Brashear here. I also suspect he had a good part in bringing KOTALIK here. On the others? I couldn't tell you. I would say GILROY and LISIN both seem like guys he'd target and the PROSPAL connection is undeniable(even though they supposedly didn't get along in Tampa)...GABORIK and the GOMEZ trade, however, smack of Sather moves IMO. Ditto with the Jokinen and Boyle trades...on the draft comment, I'll just disregard this as a snide remark...now something that folks here brought up recently about your concept of a top-down rebuild....Look what happened when they DID try that concept...Everything they brought in from those trades is gone. Now I'm sure you'll argue that the screwed the whole process up by bringing in JAGR(I patently disagree, but...). Still, that's a great example of how a so-called top-down rebuild can go awry. Let's say they field a lineup where Giroux is a first-liner and Barnaka a top-defender. Then they tank for three straight years. I still don't see the guarantee that they're going to be in the bottom three of the NHL, especially with LUNDQVIST between the pipes...AND the bottom line is that if everything worked as you say it does...if teams could just tank for three years and then come up with a dynasty DON'T YOU THINK MORE GM's WOULD DO IT?!? How come Sather isn't going to Dolan saying 'ya' know, I've got a great idea...we'll tank for three years, and then I'll deliver you cup after cup after cup and you'll be ROLLING in the dough...' As much as I'd LOVE to say that hasn't happened because Sather's a fucking moron, I can't. The TRUTH is GMs don't do that because IT SUCKS TO LOSE. It sucks to be on losing teams, it sucks to be in a losing organization, and it sucks to be a loser. Plain and simple. So as much of a no-brainer as you seem to think 'tanking' is, you're failing to understand the whole goal of competing in the NHL. If your theory had even an fraction of validity, any team out mathematically eliminated from the playoffs would blow up their roster, put Pee-Wee hockey players on the ice and hope to draft the next Crosby. Obviously, that's not the case and teams still compete to win. The ones that don't have very obvious reasons for doing so, and most of them have to do with crack-pot owners too cheap to dress real NHLers. So I'm sorry, but I think you're about as wrong in your assessment of this league as wrong can be...NOW...the one bone I will throw you is that it IS wise to trade up in a deep draft...and I've always been an advocate of it. If you can recall, I was calling for the Rangers to put a pitch in for the third-overall to draft DUCHENE. And here, we finally get on the same page, because I think Sather's too much of a schmuck to not see where a deal like that could really benefit his team. End of story.
tdchi
stevielegs.......You asked "Ken how old are Heatley, Gaborik & Kovalchuk et al ? Top stars not with their original team. How many Ovechkins can be on a team @ $10 per?"........One dimensional but great goal scorers seem to be available. Throw Hossa in with them too. Lesser centers, like a Gomez and a Drury, a Jokinen......all fairly easy to aquire. But, try getting that stud center in his prime or that rare, special forward like an OV that puts his team on his back, a great leader, a franchise defenseman. Those guys don't seem to move until the team they grew up with can't keep it together anymore and win (Think Vinny LC). They have to start over, so maybe those guys get cut loose when they are in their early to mid 30s. Starting to build your team around a 30 year old OV will not be the same as a 20 year old OV.........Messier is one of the few to do that. He was one of the greats of all time. TGO couldn't with LA...............................The "new NHL" has seen the draft take on an even bigger role than before. It seems the best way to build and sustain a team now is to draft "the guy" making max, draft 2-3 others making 5-7mil, a couple of select fill-in guys (usually vets that are interchangeable as years go by) making 3mil or so.........and the rest.....fill in with drafted role players who know their role and don't ask to be paid more plus vets who will do the same. If any of your drafted or vet role players ask for more $$$, unless they are part of your top 3-4 guys, "sorry.....there's the door." You are replaceable. Lou Lamiorello is a perfect example. He paid Brodeur. He paid Stevens, Niedemeyer, Elias. He will pay guys if they are worth it. He refused to pay Gomez, Holik, etc., etc. But, there were the dopey NYR who knew better.........So, to answer your question, you can only pay one OV, but that's all you need. The Caps will probably pay OV, Backstrom, Green, maybe Semin and fill in the rest with guys who will accept their role at a reasonable price. These kinds of teams cannot afford to pay 3-5Mil to role players like Staal, Calli, or Dubi.........and guess what? They 'aint worth it! Replacable guys! Get the 3-4 irreplaceable guys and take care of them first. Everyone else is along for the ride or shown the door. A good GM can work with that. Go Donnie Walsh!!! Damn........THAT is what I'm talking about!!! AND, it is happening IN the Garden and under Jimmy boy's watch so, YES, it can be done. Hoops is different for sure but holy shit is Donnie going for it! That's the "other way" we're all searching for right there. If you don't want to tank and rebuild, target the best of the best when they become available and clear out your cap the couple of years prior. Are the guys too old and will it work though??? Will those guys really become available before they are too old? Drafting is a much better bet.
Ken
RF4L---NOTHING matters except for Sunday! And you guys have to root for Pronger, Crosby, Richards and Uncle Daddy Marty!
Bob
Sweden won it's 2nd Olympic game today 4 to 2 and the King watched from the pressbox! Can we fire Tortorella and hire the Swedish coach please?!
RF4L
Yes I'll give you Barank and his injuries but you can't argue that Sather has not maximized (not even close) his assets over the last 6 years since the fire sale, where he stated that he was finally 'allowed' to build the team the way he wanted to since he got here in '99-2000. That seems like total BS when we see him year after year fill NHL roster spots with FAs. I'm not saying that the team would have been better if we had ALL of those kids put on the Rangers. BUT by having such a logjam of vets the kids are not getting any real chance to break in the the big club and that has hurt them and the whole organization IMHO. Would we be worse with POTTER and SANGS or Heikenin instead of the Twin Horrors? Really? And we would have the cap space to trade/sign a quality 1st liner we need. I'm really sick of Sather apologists - there is NO excuse for the last 10 years for a friggin NY franchise and one of the original 6 teams. It's sickening and embarrassing to see these same conversations for almost a decade. FIRE OR RETIRE SATHER or at least die already you old fuck!!!
NYStranger
We also had Lyashenko commit suicide after repeated threats on his family back home by the Russian mob.
DanyloHalytskyj
NYStranger : I think you mean Ivan Baranka, he was injury prone, and decided he wanted to go back to Russia and play. He never really developed due to his injuries, and the timeing of them. So If that who your talking about, I dont theink Sather or any GM could have done any difrent. That would be like saying that the GM messed up with Stefan Cherneski...
Wildcard
Dany: Ducks dont have hands! .... Doughnt yu no notten ? :-)
mf
I meant Immonen not Neimenen
NYStranger
Mess11- that is one of my biggest gripes of Sather's regime. He collects assets then lets them walk without any return. The great fire sale produced basically zip because Sather either let those assets walk to free agency or Europe or he let them devalue in the minors because there is always a log jam of freshly signed vets on the Rangers. Most of our 'kids' never get a sniff of the NHL and Sather never gives them a chance which devalues them and he is never smart enough to trade them before they become worthless. Look at a gpod dozen decent players since the lock-out which we got NOTHING for. Montoya is #1 - what the hell did he hold on to him so long for then trade for nothing? Neimenen, that Russian D-man that came up with Toots. (forget his name) too many to list right now. Why hasn't a few guys form Hartford gotten a look this year? Because MSG is not interested in anything but getting into the play-offs. No time for experiments and looks in NYC. No wonder we loose so many young guys to free agency/Europe. The Knicks wasting the last 2 years to clear cap space hurts us as well IMO. Dolan needs some team playing at MSG in the spring. It used to be the Knicks that tried to make a run every year when the Rangers missed the play-offs for 7 straight. Now it is the Rangers turn to do it. Maybe when the Knicks get to make their big moves a put together a free agent dream team and they start to make some play-off noise, the Rangers will be allowed to make moves to clear salary and build properly? Who knows what is going on at MSG but I really think that both teams are tied together more then we realize.
NYStranger
RF4L - completely forgot he was included in that deal - ok, well then, I'd really like to take Sbisa off the Ducks' hands.
DanyloHalytskyj
danylo: Sbisa is now a Duck - he was part of the huge package the Flyers sent Anahiem for Pronger.
RF4L
I would love to take Sbisa off the Flyers' hands.
DanyloHalytskyj
mf I'm surprised the Forsberg rumors haven't started again.....
stevielegs
good morning: thank you all for the spirited posts of the last few days, Sather must make some moves if he intends on signing Staal...some here have pined for Volenchenko, well with a thin crop of UFA's, Staal's asking price should go up.....some here mention Mueller of Phoenix, granted he may be worth a shot, was a high pick, but does he just add redundancy to the line-up? We need guys that can bury the puck .... Kovalchuk, at what price? Can he play on a line with Oli ? ...E: you wrote a great post 2-3 weeks ago about the addition to OJ and how his addition allowed for our 2nd & 3rd lines to fall into some semblance... Oli's a big body, IMO, properly cast as the 2nd line center...could serve to open managements eyes a bit that when you bring in a player which has had some success, you dont try to recreate them into something else. (that list is endless here in Rangerland) If we are going to be able to fill 2 of the 3 big holes in this team, and resign Stall, two or Drury/Rozi/Redden need to go, or, and more likely, Rozi / Voros / one or 2 more smaller contracts, and some guys may get traded...Hopefully someone finds Rozi attractive for the homestretch, he's the easiest of the bigger contracts to move....Hopefully the Ranger org are watching the Olympics closely for some international talent that may become available...
mf
If we let Heikinen and Parenteau walk because of our unwillingness to waive Redden and maybe Voros, then Sather really does have to go.
Messier11
Hey all, it may have been already mentioned on here, but Zippy has updates on 5 Pack players in his blog. Interesting stuff that's always nice to read because it's so seldom done. Seems like PAP and Heikkenin won't be back next year and who can blame them? The Rangers have been unimpressive far more often than not, yet neither, especially the Finn, have really been given much of a chance. Guess that means the organization isn't impressed OR Sather sucks. Probably both - definitely the latter.
RF4L
so does dolan green light sather to free up cap space like he just did with walsh and the knicks? Seems to me the genius always has a green light, he's just colored blind. He needs to send Redden anywhere , and off the cap. He'll be fine making his millions teaching kids something about D & the nhl if nobody wants him; and how to dupe a gm like sather. That could be just 1 chapter in an epic the size of moby dick. ....go for it glennie, match donnie and show him up genius........juggle those rings, some people think that makes you the wiz of hockey......prove it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
stevielegs
Ken, Desi & RF4L- Yeah, I understand your pts too. I am just trying to say that it is not easy. The odds of a try like that going south -- is pretty high. And there are other concerns too, how do we suck that much with Lundqvist between the pipes? All I am saying, is that the OBVIOUS best option to build a Stanley Cup winning team FOR US is to just do everything with a lot of patient and a great plan. Slats could never pull that off, but still.
Ola
Ken how old are Heatley, Gaborik & Kovalchuk et al ? Top stars not with their original team. How many Ovechkins can be on a team @ $10 per? It's not the past & the future, deal with the present. ....FIRE OR RETIRE SATHER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.....this team with 2 good additions a center and a D man 2 good subtractions Redden & whomever necessary, can contend. If the coach gets his head out of his ass, shuts his punk mouth, & stops living on his past ring. ........what have you done for me lately?........ little tougherella is afraid of sather....and is not getting him to make big enough changes or moves.......nobody can besides dopey who is in knickland. Maybe after he lands Lebron, he'll take a look at the NYR.
stevielegs
stevielegs....I love Barbie! She can't be one of those "no cups" types though. I have standards. The "Old Garden" eh? Wow....that's cool. Now I feel like a kid. I get what you're saying and I understand not wanting to go through a rebuild.......I just see what we DO go through as worse because there's no hope. And then.....there's the cap and we're maxed out and in 23rd place as VtRanger pointed out. Big Deal Neil was a lot of fun, going for it every year but those days are over. How else can this be fixed? Maybe like the Knicks are doing? MSG seems pretty full enough for Knick games and they obviously have much bigger plans than making the POs. When is OV unrestricted? Sidne........nope, not even going there. Hockey is different. Being more of a team game, guys like that will stay with their team for a long time. I don't think you can get those guys (in their best years) other than drafting high and I don't think you can contend without them. Even TGO didn't win with LA and no cap. It just doesn't work.
Ken
stevielegs.........When you wrote "Sather is INCAPABLE of getting to the finals. The rest is mental masturbation" I laughed out loud for like 3 minutes........I pretty much disagree with 90% of what you say but I always read your posts. That was really funny and very true. Of course, I'll have to disagree on something so I'll pick out the "young guns might even beg to get out of here" in a rebuild with all the losing. They are drafted, so they have no choice (unless they are Lindros but who ultimately won that battle)? If I'm Stamkos I'd rather be in Tampa. If I'm Duschene, give me Colorado. Those teams are moving upwards or at least trying. Both have won cups with youth and developed drafted players into all-stars. Besides, you can always play for the country club team in the big city when your real team needs to move on and rebuild again. Then, you play for cash, not cups. It's different here.
Ken
Ken would you go out with a Barbie? ;-) I've been to the old Garden, no stinking rebuild for me. Give me a new GM, get the jerkoff genius out of here. .......EDDIE EDDIE......
stevielegs
RF4L....No coincidence at all with the Devils......they are looking good right now but Kovalchuk or not, they won't match up in the POs with the Pens or Caps. Brodeur is getting older and the Devils run is in its final stages........What a run it was! It started in the early '90s and incredibly sharp (and disciplined) management got the absolute most out of a great goup of drafted players. They had the "feeder system" to keep it going. They found 1st line all-star players mid-late first round, not 15 goal grinders. But, like Detroit, they too soon will wane. I wouldn't be surprised to see Detroit or NJ "tanking" in the next couple of years to try and start over and do it for another 15-20 years. The NYR should try to emulate the Devils in the mid 80s. All started with guys like Shanny. Instead, we get Shanny at age 38, draft no all-stars or hall of famers.....we have a "feeder system" but what does it sustain? 8th place. Whoopee!
Ken
TD: Are you saying that the Rangers are a "decent team (mediocre at worst)"? Really??? We are 23rd out of 30 teams. Do you have to be in last place to qualify as a bad team in your view?
VtRanger
Crosby gets the shootout winner and Brodeur the final save. Why did I watch that?????
shonuff
I don't think the TV reception (hi-def or not) will be very good where I'll be after 54 years more........lol. I'll probably be wearing my Graves jersey though. "Graves" jersey......that's kinda weird.......Crosby just ended the scare for Canada. It's the ref's fault! Bettman planned it! It's rigged!
Ken
desi04......You are right on about the goalies....They are so necessary, yet you can get them later in the draft. You also can get real good ones in trades (for unequal value usually) too. Lots of teams have won cups without a goalie that they had drafted or one drafted in the top 15 picks of a draft. Not too many win cups without a top drafted center and at least a couple of other top drafted players within their core. The '94 NYR were one of the few.....There were a lot of weird, "never happen again" circumstances with that team but they did it. Somehow. Call me selfish but I don't want to wait another 54 years for the next miracle.
Ken
desi04.......Wow! 45 years! I thought I was a long time die hard. I got caught up with hockey in the late 70s Islander/Ranger battles and hid under my covers in front of my TV when WOR-9 showed the NYR in the Spectrum.......Thank god I had to watch those games in black and white or I REALLY would have been scared with all the NYR blood and all........lol......Go figure...a Long Island kid committing to becoming a NYR fan in the late 70s......Ha! I wouldn't have it any other way.....Maybe all the verbal abuse I took as a kid from all the Islander fans is what makes me appreciate the power of the draft so much.......What you said that bothers me the most is how the NYR just continue to do the same thing over and over again and never even try it the time proven way. After all the years between the two of us......we need a change. Funny too how it's some of the older fans willing to put up with a rebuild more so than the younger guys. Maybe we're just numb from it all. To think how close we came to not even getting that ONE cup in 70 years........We're scary bad. One of the most pathetic in all of professional sports. Chicago just left that tag behind them. If they can do it, so can we except a lot of great players were missed already. No better time to start than today. Enough of this crap.
Ken
tdchi.....still catching up and a little behind.....sorry about that...The last one I read you asked...."Have you watched the Bolts lately?" Yes, I watched them live at MSG (from the 10th row.....don't ask me how....people like to give me great tix once in awhile) last Sunday. Hedman was very, very good for a first year player. Stepped up and stopped rushes at the blue line routinely. Physical. Made great plays and yes a few mistakes. Stamkos was a horse in the first, then scary with his shot a few times after that. He had 2-3 points I think. Both stood out every time they were on the ice. The rest of the Bolts aren't there yet but those two are worth the price of admission and you don't get those guys mid 1st round.........."Bolts have no goalie"......I don't really get the point nor do I care about their goalie....We have a very good goalie. Gets us nowhere. Aren't the Bolts, with two players and no goalie ahead of us in the standings? "Hawks and Caps need a goalie." Exactly why we should ask for Backman or Toews/Kane for ours and something else.....or, pick top 3 and get our own......As for Torts......He has won a cup (in the last five years no less) and last time I checked, no one else associated with the NYR has done that. Maybe, just maybe we should try things Torts' way. Or not. Really makes no difference because he has no players and won't be here much longer no matter what happens with this version of a NYR pickup squad. "Torts has to prove Tampa won because of him?" Why......no team wins championships "because" of their coach. Coaches can help some or hurt some. Some more than others. Why discredit his cup? It's not like he walked into a 1990 Oilers situation like Muckler. He grew with those guys. I could ask what Tampa has done without him.......obviously rebuild. "Torts pointed Sather towards Brashear"........Well, I don't know how you know that but if he did, it was a mistake. Brashear is gone now.....Did Torts steer Sather towards Shelley or was that all Slats....How about Prust, Prospal, Boyle, Gaborik, Lisen, Gilroy. Did Torts influence any of last June's draft or do we wait to see who the busts are and then those are the Tortorella guys..........let me know.
Ken
a/Wildcard – Couldn't agree more. Yeah, it's a no-brainer: If you pick high in the draft, your CHANCES of getting a franchise player greatly increase. But does that mean you'll get one? Nope...And that reminds me of something someone(can't remember who)posted here when I urged patience with the rebuild...which is that there is no patience when the last NY cup is getting more and more distant with each day...EXACTLY. No GM in their right mind would take a decent team(mediocre at worst), blow it up, lose for three or four seasons and hope that they're going to get a slew of franchise players to establish a franchise. NO TEAM would do that. Not unless they're bankrupt and on the verge of being moved...or that they're so incredibly bereft of talent that they have no choice...some of you guys really lack a functional understanding of the clusterfuck scenarios that faced some of the top teams in the NHL. These were generally not teams that went along with the so-called rebuild...THEY HAD NO CHOICE. Pittsburgh, we all know their situation...some have brought up Chicago...well does the name "Dollar Bill" Wirtz?!? Here's a quick bio: Wirtz was blamed for the loss of both Dominik Hasek and Ed Belfour, for trading Denis Savard...Chris Chellios to Detroit for the trading of Jeremy Roenick...also blamed for the Blackhawks' cup drought, which is the second longest in NHL history...under his ownership, the Blackhawks were named by ESPN in 2004 as the worst franchise in sports...In 2002, ESPN ranked Wirtz as the third greediest owner in all of sports...
tdchi
http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=518094
stevielegs
http://www.nhl.com/ice/recap.htm?id=2009090006
stevielegs
http://www.newsday.com/sports/hockey/rangers/blue-notes-1.811976............parial wolfpack report............
stevielegs
RF4L I remember sometimes, alias sometimzers. Guys like Jagr & Messier are elite talents, but very different from each other. And many didn't want Mess either, except in 1993,4, 5. To follow the rebuild logic here , they should trade Gaborik & Lundqvist ( 2 of sather's better signings) so they can get 4-6 good guys for the future. The NYR do that, and I'm done. To me that's lunacy. And to expect Gaborik & Lundqvist to hang on for the sather rebuild is asking way too much. And no top UFAS will come near this place, only the Reddens. And top kids might even beg to get out of here. It's no fun losing, and not making the playoffs. That experience is not gained in the regular season.. Even mediocrity has a shot at the Cup, while learning. Of course being better than that is the goal. But plenty of good teams don't get to the finals. This is NYC not penciltucky. The Wolfpack are dying for more fans in the stands or watching on pay for view. I pass.
stevielegs
so the nyr tank, they then get to pick 1-5. If they are 3,4, 5 they miss the top 2 . They don't get a Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin, Tavares, Stamkos. Then there's always next year, to tank and possibly miss again. Where is the guarantee that tanking gets you the top pick? The Pens & the Caps got the #1 picks, that's a BIG part of what they are today. Then the Pens got a GM with brains and balls, and hired a new coach to get them the Cup. Washington still hasn't won one. So what's the difference? The goal is to make it to the finals, neither the NYR nor the Caps have done so in a long time. Sather is INCAPABLE of getting to the finals. The rest is mental masturbation. .....And BIG deal Tortorella won A Cup, Keenan won A Cup, one and done alias one hit wonders can happen every year. The guys with multiple Cups are better than them, they are better than the no cuppers. Coaches with final appearance are almost forgotten. ......Desi fredo can't handle things, so you'll have to live a long happy life in retirement, along with aggravation and frustration of being a nyr fan...... ;-)........
stevielegs
stevie: Yes, hindsight is 20/20 but too bad there's no archives (or if there is, too bad I couldn't be bothered going back that far) but I never liked the JJ acquisition from the beginning. I'll admit I got excited in the first post lock-out year when the Rangers, led by JJ and his posse, surprised everyone (including, unfortunately the GM) and overachieved for 2/3's of the year. However, since the end of the Olympics 4 years ago, they've been an 8th place team and I started calling to have JJ and starting part way thru year 2 post lock-out, I was calling for Sather to trade JJ and most of his posse. Of course, Sather in all his wisedom, thought like many on here and failed to recognize the impossibility of plugging on the organizational holes via UFA. And here we are today, at best an 8th place early PO club - something I, for one, started rejecting over 3 years ago!!!
RF4L
tdchi..........You wrote..."What would this wall be like if we lost 45 games per year for a few years." You would have to ask a Penquins or Caps fan what their wall was like during the down years. They could probably tell you if it was worth it. Funny thing is......our years are all pretty much down years except for a little "false excitement" back in 2006.......You wrote..."Where does it say on god's green earth that a team must have a top pick to be a cup contender?" In the NHL history books. Look at Hockeydb.com.....draft by team. Pick a cup winner, go back and look up their drafts. Not many won cups without drafting their core guys.......almost always drafted top 3-5. With some teams, you have to go back a ways. For example, it was a long time after drafting Yzerman and Lidstrom that the Wings put it together. That doesn't change the result and the fact that those guys were key core pieces in their cups. Franchise D-man and team captain......drafted high......You see, the NYR are drafting ass-backwards.......They are drafting the fill in guys first. But, they left out the most important part.......the top talent. We can't try to emulate Detroit or NJ or Colorado as you mentioned because we never drafted the top players that they did. Now, we are mediocre again and have no way to get the top talent. Cup winners get the key core pieces first, then fill in from a weaker draft position as the team improves.........You said "the best teams build through a feeder system." I would argue that the feeder system is part II.......The Devils, Wings, and Avalanche didn't build their cup champions with core top talent from a feeder system. That is what sustained them but take away the highly drafted, most talented key drafted guys on their roster and what good is the feeder system?................Want more proof? You said......"Getting a top 3 pick would be the only consolation" for losing 45 games per year.........Here are the top 3 picks since '03......MA. Fleury, E. Staal, N. Horton.....'04...OV, Malkin, C. Barker.....'05....Sid, B. Ryan, Jack Johnson.....'06.....Eric Johnson, J. Staal, J.Toews, and I have to include #4, N. Backstrom..... '07, P. Kane, J. Van Riemsdyk, Kyle Turris....'08....Stamkos, Doughty, Bogosian.....'09......Tavares, Hedman, and........Matt Duschene!!! drafted #3 overall by none other than.....yes....the Avalanche who you listed as one of the "best" teams that win by developing a feeder sytem. Funny, the last time they won cups, I remember some top draft picks by them some years prior as well! It all started for them with #1 OA Lindros. At least Neil tried to get that pick! With a "feeder" system, why is COL cycling down to pick 3rd OA? Why didn't they just simply find a JJ, a Jokinen and surround them with Dubis and Callis??? Simple. They are well managed and know when what has to be done has to be done. Colorado will win two more cups probably before we even get a sniff at the finals. Tampa too. Of the teams that drafted top 3 from '03-'05, the Pens and Canes (downcycling themselves right now) already have a cup with those pieces leading the way. The Caps, Hawks, and Kings are already banging on the door........this is what I mean by "contending" and "competing" with the elite...not winning the odd reg. season game. Colorado, TB, St Louis, maybe even Phoenix and the Islanders are on the upswing fast. All a direct result of drafting top 3. You want to argue how important their "feeder systems" are? How good would their teams be if you took the top 3 picks out of those systems......well, they'd probably look a bit like us........The Flyers......more like us despite drafting 2nd in '07. One pick is not enough unless it's a once a decade kind of guy. Philly will face the too good to pick high again problem though thus dropping them into the pack. Florida and Atlanta are just horribly mismanaged franchises (the Islanders used to be). That doesn't take away anything from the time proven build through the draft (your best players), drafting them high. It works, just as it always has..........One last point...I can't resist.....You wrote to Ola that the Russian olympic top line was "mind blowing." Do you mean OV (#1 OA), Malkin (#2 OA), and Kovalchuk (#1 OA)??? Three for three!!! I bet a lot of the top Olympians were drafted high. Makes perfect sense to me. Which teams have the most top picks? I bet they are the favorites for gold. It's so simple it's silly.......The most talented guys get drafted high.....The teams that draft high the most get very talented.....and.....they win championships. The teams that do that PLUS manage very well win multiple championships...that is where the "feeder system" comes in....to keep it going as long as possible. I rest my case.
Ken
Ola you are right I think you have a better chance of finding a diamond in the rough in later rounds in hockey than basketball but basketball in the past also drafted kids from high school aka Lebron. If you look alot of the later round studs in hockey are usually goalies.
desi04
Ola I just making a point that a couple minor injuries might get us a shot at a possible stud hockey player or we might draft a dud with the first pick. If you look at the last 15 yrs. in the basketball draft the stud players are drafted in the top 3 picks.
desi04
tdchi.......Just found the time to respond...I'm going to try to condense it a bit. On JJ....I didn't mean his play or performance set us back 10 years but his aquisition by Sather instead of going in a smarter direction. JJ "done"....yes, as far as being a guy to build a championship team around, yes...donner than done. "JJ belonged in NY"...Sadly, this is true. He was a perfect fit. We've seen his type (at his age) many times in blue. "Gabby and JJ on the wing and we'd be far more deadly than we are today." How "deadly" are we now? That's not saying much. It wouldn't work....still no center and no defense. Purchased all-star teams don't win cups. Drafting core guys who become all-stars in your uniform does. "What did the NYR (suckers) give up for JJ?" and you mention Anson Carter. That's not what they gave up. They gave up their half-ass self-proclaimed rebuild to try and "win now" with veterans and Hank. In doing that, they gave up their future hopes of drafting core all-star players.....like the ones drafted in the top three from 2004 through the present and therefore any real chance to build a cup contender.....and, no less important, they started the process of screwing their cap situation with JJ and filling in around him. This after 7 years of spinning their wheels and telling the fans they would build through the draft. Their way of building through the draft is ridiculous. The types of guys they draft are readily available in the later rounds and through trades.........Never said Orpik was a future hall of famer but I did say Staal is no Orpik and I stand by that. You try to diminish the value of high picks by citing a couple of busts and a couple of later picks that turned out great, and say that it is the NYR "organizational philosophy" to focus on just those types, plucking gems later in the draft........picking the "right" guys, with "attitude," and all the NYR and their great philosophy need is time and patience from us fans. "There are so many variables." The biggest variable is draft position. A second is making those high picks count through excellent scouting. "Stop comparing the NYR to organizations with totally different draft and team building philosopies." That's already done for me and they keep it up to date every day........It's called the standings. The teams that win go very low and very high. The teams that win multiple championships go very, very low, then very, very high and usually can sustain that (if they draft well in lesser draft position) for a decade or more before going low again. The NYR, however don't move much in the standings. The other teams come and go but there are the NYR.....that model of consistency.....with their "organizational phiosophy" along with their never ending appetite for yesterday's news.......entrenched in 7-10th place. Sure, they'll win a regular season game over the Penns and Caps once in awhile.........but yet, there they are, where they belong, where it counts......in the standings, and much more importantly, in the POs.
Ken
Desi- I am not a expert on the NBA, but isn't Basketball player much better when they are drafted? Hockey is a pretty complex sport, you need to be able to do as much as a basketball player, AND do it on skates. Most players aren't a finnished product until they are 22-23 years old, but are drafted when they are 18. Its like there is two drafts. One of the extremely early bloomers, and then one in the late 2nd round/3rd round and later of the rest. Hence why there are so many late round steals in hockey.
Ola
Stevielegs you are right its just that Fredo pays Ferrari prices for Yugo's.
desi04
Recent Best Quotes: RF4L - " hockey is passing me by and its only the early 90's" -Glen Sather. Steveielegs - Fredo Cortelone - AKA - Glen Sather lol
desi04
Hey Desi04, Dont get so excited, your Blood Pressure is going to max out...Your comments are falling on deaf ears. Nobody cares about the rangers... they suck.
myrtletrailers
hindsight is 20/20 usually. They could have won The Cup with Jagr if Sather knew his onions. He doesn't. To miy mind you go for it every year without cleaning out your feeder system. Brains and Balls to the wall.Otherwise go watch the Wolfpack.
stevielegs
RF4L.......Your post from 06:02:18 today was as dead on as they come. In my mind, bringing in JJ was a huge mistake and Sather did nothing but compound that mistake exponentially after that. First, trying to surround him to win, then, losing him for nothing, then spending all his $$$ trying to quickly make up for losing JJ. All for what??? Like you perfectly said.....It was all for 8th place finishes and 1st round PO appearances. Now where are we..........we're screwed that's where. I echo your "*SIGH*"
Ken
And let's not forget that 2 of the big 4 cogs in the Rangers 94 win weren't drafted - one, in fact, was basically bought (Messier) and the other stolen (Graves) from under the nose of 'hockey is passing me by and it's only the early 90s' Glen Sather!!!
RF4L
JIM--Yup :)
chinstrap
stevie: If I were in Dolans position I'd fire that incompetent fossilized piece of crap Sather and hire a young(ish) bright hockey man and tell him I want a team that will be competitive for years and go about achieving that goal as best he thought possible. If it meant bottoming out, so be it. This can be done without trading either of the King or Gabbie, but both might not be too happy playing under those circumstances. That said, drafting 1 of Hall or Seguin this year might be enough, provided the organization can shed 2 of the big 3 albatross contracts (the hoRRor twins and Dreary). I'd let the new man decide Tortorella's fate, too.
RF4L
chin: Is that your opinion?!?!
RF4L
desi I can't retire. You're lucky. There WILL NOT be a Cup with Sather. He can't get himself arrested. But rebuild is a waste of time. Would you invest in a rebuild team? The NYY took 9 years to win another series, but they buy talent. The genius buys anything, especially gambling, rehab, or reclaimation projects. The rebuilders are dreaming. They won't even show up to the games. Dolan is not that dumb, just dopey.
stevielegs
Oopps, meant to add that since their last cup win, the Devils have been competitive during the regular season, then have flamed out in the POs. The former is commendable but as their lack of PO success since 02/03 attests, that's no match for talent when that talent is committed to playing hard, which is what happens to most teams once the POs come around (thereby, eliminating the advantage teams like the hard working Devils have in the regular season so often). And how interesting it is to note that both Stevens and Niedemayer left a year after the Devils last cup win and not a single highly drafted player has donned their jersey since. A coincidence? Ahhh....no.
RF4L
Citing the NJ Devils as a team that won the cup without high draft picks contributing is somewhat misleading. The team was built around Brodeur (a late first round pick), but in each of their 3 cup wins they were anchored defensively by 3rd overall selected Scott Niedemeyer and 5th overall selected Scott Stevens (acquired via trading 2nd overall picked Shanahan).
RF4L
Nice to see DRURY get a goal. Interesting to hear them talk about how respected he is and how great he is on the bench in terms of talking. He might not be scoring enough, or come close to being worth his contract,but he's not the awful leader most people here make him out to be. I'll take the opinions of fellow players and people in or around the NHL over people on an internet board on that one.
chinstrap
Stevielegs I am not saying to trade Gabby or Lundqvist but if they say twist theirs knees in the olympics, nothing major but maybe miss the rest of the games for this season we have a good shot at a top pick ala San Antonio in the NBA David Robinson goes down & they draft Duncan 3 championships. You have to be lucky also that their will be a stud in the draft. I am just tired of a mediocre team that's all. If we are in the 4th or 5th spot we probably can swing a deal for the 1st pick with our pick & a dubi -sangs offer. I am close to retirement I want to see another cup. When we won in 1994 I thought as the sign said I can now die in peace but no I want more. lol
desi04
I haven't been able to read all of this BUT, if you were dolan what would you do?. Why not trade Gaborik & Lundqvist to rebuild. You'll be looking for fannie for the seats, there'd be few paying fans. What fans want is not equal to what owners want. And what sather can do is not much, even if his boss didn't request make the playoffs. The guy isd not a hockey genius. ....And all the Jagr bashers line up behind the Mesdsier basshers. There were Leetch bashers too. As sather would defend himself, nobodyu's perfect, and he's more than eough proof !!!!!
stevielegs
Vic- About 30% of all 3-5 overall picks becomes very good players. Suck tremendously for 3 straight years, odds are that you will get 1 very good players. Top 2 look better. But the odds to get a real franchise stud player with a top 2 pick isn't that great eitehr. In 10 years, from 1990 to 1999, there was 20 top 2 picks. Of them, 5 players became real franchise players. Lindros, Pronger, Dan Sedin, Vincent Lecavalier and Joe T. So with a top 2 pick over 10 years, only 25% became big stars. The 15 others aren't a impressing bunch, Jovocop, Tverdovsky, Stefan, Legwand, Marleau, Philips, Zyuzin, Berard, Redden, Hamerlik, Yashin, Pat Fallon, Nolan and Nedved. 2000 to 2005, look a lot better. But in the end I think its hard to say that there is more then say 30-50% chance to get a real franchise stud. Like players like Marleau, Legwand, Philips and co are really solid players, but they don't make or break a hockey team. They make very little difference in that prespective.
Ola
Vic: I agree about the draft. Also, the Ragners recent draft have looked better, at elast early on. There were yeras and years that they barly got 1 players who was NHL material, even for a3rd/4th line level. But the las few years you see 2, 3, 4 players who will probably make teh NHL in some form. Now that doenst win you the cup because MOST of those guys will be nothing more than 3rd, 4th line players. But that tells me that teh scouting and system for drafting is better, and that gives me hope that if they draft higher tehy will end up with a good pick. Now some people will point to Brendl or Daigle, but how many teams would haev picked them were they were in the draft? Brendl at #4 didnt seem so bad at teh time did it? I mean, maybe some said he should go a few picks later or what not, but noone i remember thought he would be playing in Europe now. And who really thought Daigle would flop so badly?? Even Jessiman, there were ALOT of experts and people in the NHL that thought he was a first rounder, or at the worst an early 2nd rounder...well it turns out he was neither...but if the Rangers hadnt grabbed him at 12th (it was 12th right) than he may have gone by the number 15 pick....in fact I remember rumors before the draft that the Devils were interested in him....who knows if that is true, but the fact is, most of the players drafted in the first round ar thought of by most teams as a first round guy, and most team draft boards, with the exception of the top 3 or 4 picks, are in totaly difrent orders, some probably so far off from others the scouting staffs would laugh at each other. I just think that all fans are too hard ont heir own teams whenj it comes to drafting...and some liek teh Devils are held up like they draft a super star every year...
Wildcard
Vic: Bravo!!!
VtRanger
I just want to add something to this discussion about drafting in the top 5. I've mentioned this before but I think it is worth repeating. There are a lot of people (media included) who like to point out a particular player or two that were taken at the top of the draft and turned out to be busts as evidence that drafting high is "go guarantee" of getting a great player. This is really a straw-man argument for three reasons. FIRST: There are never guarantees about anything, including high-dollar free agent signings or big trades. As bad as the Rangers' draft record has been their UFA/Trade record has probably been worse. There have been VERY few players that were brought in via UFA or trade since 94 that have worked out anywhere near expectations. The bigger the "star" brought in usually has meant the worse the end result but we could literally fill a DESPO sized post with nothing but names of Ranger UFA signing and trade failures from the past 15+ years. SECOND: While it is possible to pick a bust at the top of the draft, it is very unlikely from a percentage perspective if you look at the draft history for the last 20 years or so. Similarly, it is possible to draft an elite player when picking in the middle of the pack (12th-20th) but it is very unlikely from a percentage perspective when you look at the draft history of the last 20 years. To sum that up, you probably have about a 90%-95% chance of drafting an elite player when you pick in the top 3 or 5, and you have about a 5%-10% chance of drafting a star player when you draft in the middle of the pack in the first round. Stringing two or three bad years in a row where you draft in the top 3 to 5 is without a doubt a viable and repeatable way to build a team around a core group of elite young players. Stringing 10-15 years of mediocre teams in a row is a viable and repeatable way to build a mediocre team that maybe drafts 1 elite player over that span if you are lucky. THIRD: The argument about possibly drafting a bust when you draft in the top 5 completely misses the point. The point is that when you draft in the top 5 you at least have the opportunity to draft no-brainer elite players. When you never draft in the top 5 you never even have the opportunity to draft no-brainer elite players. Several weeks ago I posted a long list of players that the Rangers never had the opportunity to draft over the last 20+ years because they never bottomed out and drafted in the top 5. The list was filled with no-brainer elite players and a bunch of other guys that while not no-brainer elites were certainly highly touted prospects that were expected to become all-star type players. I don't buy the argument that you can't rebuild by bottoming out in NY. I never had and never will accept that premise simply because I see the pattern of mediocrity that the Rangers have followed throughout most of their history (and certainly the last 15 years) as infinitely more frustrating and intolerable as a fan.
Vic
Why can't we build a contender like NJD have? Like Detroit have? Why? Why take a 15% shot when you can take a 100% shot? Bring in a good coach that knows what he is doing. Not fucking idiot who is all about "accountability", but one that have a plan of what to do on the ice. And a GM that have any sense of patient and can build a team long term. NJD have lost 1st overall picks because of tampering. They have lost 1st overall picks because they where forced to get rid of bad contracts. They had no talent in the pipe line after being a contender for ever. Nobody can say that they lived on great draftpicks from the past, that 100% BS. Brouder and Elias or what? A bunch of teams can match that. We have 50x the chance to do what they are doing now, and do it 10x better and become a real contender. How should that be done? Keep ONE team together. Draft well, we have good scouts. Don't "bail" players out by shipping them out right away when they are not working -- it have become a bad habit in NY. See Kotalik, Gomez and co. Or Dubinsky and co. They suck so Slats brings in new names, on a quater by quater basis almost. They are never pressured to perform. They never face the concquences if they don't perform. Come to NY and suck, nothing happeneds you get to play the PO's with another team instead. Why does almost nobody want us just to build a team in a proper way? Like Detroit for example?
Ola
Ola: Didn't you mother tell you that there are no guarantees in life in general? ;^) I understand totally your point, but it's more a case of increasing the advantages (or decreasing if you're choosing Glen Sather's style of rebuild) of being successful. It's unarguable that the higher you pick in the draft the better your chances are of securing talent, just as it's obvoius that the more picks you have the better your chances at finding NHL talent. Yesterday TD posed the argument that Mike Green was selected low in the first round in his stance that bottoming out isn't the only way to draft highly skilled players and he's right, but what wasn't said is that the year he was picked, Washington not only had the 1st overall pick but had made trades to land the 27th overall pick (used to select Green) and the 29th pick (used to take Jeff Schultz). Strength in numbers and all that (and how interesting that all 3 are now playing for the Capitals). Yes, Washington is lucky Green is as good as he is, but McPhee did a superb job at accumulating extra picks, thereby giving him the opportunity to take a chance on a guy like Green who's offensive talent was clearly recognized, but came with questions about his play defensively. That, IMO, is rebuilding 101 - a concept Glen Sather and more importantly (not to mention depressingly) New York doesn't seem to be capable of comprehending. Instead, the best us fans can hope for is unwavering mediocrity. How lovely!
RF4L
There are no gaurantees whatsoever with a longterm bottom out. The probability is that you get stuck in the cellar. After 3-4 years you start feeling pressure to make the PO's, before you have gathered enough talent, and get stuck in a negative spiral. Getting 8-14th overall picks, while destroying the talent you have gathered. Sure, finnish last overall in the NHL 2 straight years and draft two talents like AO and Malkin -- and you become a longterm contender. So many things can go wrong though. You finnish 27th overall instead for 3 striaght years and just gets half assed talents. You loose the lottery. The 1st overall pick you get is the next Daigle, Stefan, Philips or something like that -- instead of the next AO. Tampa did what everyone on here dream of -- they got 2 first overall type of players (the year they got Hedman had two "1st overall" type of players, that happeneds too, no denying that...). Lets see when Tampa becomes a contender.
Ola
To be clear: I'm not in favor of trading Lundquist to move up in the draft. I'm simply saying that we should stop plugging the holes with short-term fixes and let the team naturally bottom out. I've said before that if we do that and retain our quality young players (plus Hank & Gabby), this team can be very good in 3 to 4 years.
VtRanger
RF4L - I do not want Vinny either. Your right Tampa would not do that trade. VTRanger isn't it amazing this franchise does the same thing over & over. The point is you have a better chance of building a team that can win mutiple cups when you have a great center & find a goalie ala Pitt with Mario, they won with Barasso. But unless you draft in the top spots the chance of getting a great center in the later are a lot harder than finding a great goalie in the later rounds.
desi04
E: You pose a valid argument. The bottom line, however, is that the Rangers lack a true number 1 center, a power winger and a mobile phyiscal defender. These are 3 significant holes, none of which likely can be addressed via UFA and if addressed via a trade, create another equally significant hole (ie Lundvqist for Stamkos solves the number 1 center issue, but creates a massive hole in net). Finishing in the bottom 5 gives the Rangers the best opportunity to solve the number 1 center hole (albeit not an immediate fix given the age of the kid they pick, which is another issue altogether).
RF4L
OK, so we want to trade the most important position for a team when you have a top 5 guy for a center who albeit has great upside? You don't win that way. Very few teams can win that way. Once you get an elite goalie, you circle the wagons around them. Stamkos as great as he is going to be is a cornerstone, but a cornerstone that you can find down the road. There are very, very few elite goalies hitting free agency. They just don't grow on trees. Forwards do become available. Case in point this coming summer and last.
E
RF4L/DESI... No way they Lightning do that deal(though intersting)... the rumors have it that the new incoming owner wants to rid the team of Lecavalier and his deal and then rebuild the team, with STAMKOS as the focl point... I think we should offer up Drury and Rozsival for Vinnie though... they take on a bigger cap hit the first two years, but still only pay out $20 Mil over two years (the Lightning are nearly $10 Mil under the cap and would pay Vinnie $20 over the next 2 years), the Lightning would save $55 Mil from dumping Vinnie and be rid of both Rozi and Drury in 2 years... we get Vinnie and save $4 Mil against our Cap... which we could then use to sign VOLCHENKO... just a thought... Non-Hockey Related... GREAT DEAL by the KNICKS.... they get T-MAC, get rid of JEFFRIES $$$ and with SACRAMENTO involved, got a better deal...
Rhet0ric
RF4L: That top 3 pick that Boston has from Toronto. It seems that many think that a top 5 pick is teh only way to get this team going in the right direction. So to move that high it would take AT LEAST 2 firsts a second and a player or two I would think. But would it be worth giving up that much? I dont know...kids can just stop developing at the junior level, and never be more than a great junior player. But than having two more mid 1st round picks wont do anything anyway, and the Rangers have a glut of 2nd round pick types...so why not go for it?
Wildcard
Desi: thanks for providing the long-term view. One cup in 70 years! The single word that best describes this team now and over its long history is "mediocrity." It's never allowed to completely crash and burn. We just plod along with successive management teams making the same dumb mistakes over and over and over again. The NHL draft was first held in 1963. We have had the #1 pick one time since then. The esteemed André Veilleux was the first overall pick in the 1965 NHL Amateur Draft, picked by the New York Rangers. As one would expect of this team, he never played a game in the NHL. As far as I can tell, aside from that single failed #1 pick, the Rangers have never selected first, second or third in any draft. The highest pick I can remember is the #4 overall that was wasted on Pavel Brendl. TD is correct that rebuilding through the draft is not the only option. Unfortunately, we've tried all the other options repeatedly without success (other than '94). Maybe we should finally try the one method that we've never attempted?
VtRanger
Brodeur - 20th, Lundqvist - 205th, Roy - 51st, Hasek - 199th, Kiprusoff - 116th, Miller - 138th , Fleury - 1st & Luongo - 4th. You have a better chance of drafting a very good to great goaltender later in the first round to the last rounds.
desi04
desi: Lundvqist for Stamkos and a 1st is very tempting, but ONLY if Sather has another trade to make immediately that fetches the team a quality young goalie. And guess what? I highly doubt Tampa would make that deal. They'd like counter with Vinnie and a first, which I'd instantly decline.
RF4L
Wild: Who are you proposing the Rangers target in your proposed trade?
RF4L
if the Rangers make the playoffs or just miss the only player on the roster who might get you the 1st or 2nd pick in the draft would be Lundqvist. Maybe you could get the second pick for Staal,Dubi, Cally & our first pick. What I hear from people on this site is that the Ranger prospects are 3rd & 4th liners maybe Stepan can be a 2nd line center so what GM would give one of the top 2 picks for our guys. (besides Sather) I would not trade Lundqvist for the 1st pick but I might think about Stamkos & Tampa 1st round pick for Lundqvist. Remember most of the top goaltenders were not early first round picks most are later round picks but your top centers are the early picks. Besides Marc Andre Fleury what goalies were in the top 3 picks. ( good goaltenders not Depietro-thanks Milberry) besides Fleury I think Luongo was drafted early by Milberry that might be it.
desi04
Actualy even better, Boston may end up with a top 3 pick, would they want even MORE picks? Toronto wont be there due to their trade for Kessel, But Boston may be willing to make a deal to give up that pick if they get enough in return...They would have, in my example 3 first round picks in 2011, and team who DIDNT take that would be silly.
Wildcard
I would imagine that any team trying to rebuild that is in the bottom 3, would take 2 1st round pick in the middle of the round and a 2nd and two young players to begin a core of young players. And they could use their 2 2011 picks to move up if need be in 2011...I would do it if I were Edmonton, or Toronto, Carolina ect.
Wildcard
Instead of seeing Gabby and Hank go down with injuries and getting a top pick, if it means that much, why not make a trade? Lets say, the 2010, and 2011 1st rounders, the 2010 2nd rounder, Sanguinetti, and lets say...umm....Stepan, for the 2nd over all pick. I mean no matter what the Rangers wont be one of the bottom 3 teams....I dont think it matters at this point, the bad teams are truly horrid already and WANT those top picks, so they will lose if need be, but Would that be too much to give up for the "sure thing"?
Wildcard